Amazon orders 100,000 electric delivery trucks,

What's typical A-hr capacity of the batteries?

Indeed, that potential and having to have both the time and location to ensure could go somewhere (and get back) make the whole concept totally unworkable for anything except the niche commuting market or the like.

Of course, there's a large niche of day-commuters so they would have a place. If one can do without the alternate general-purpose, on-demand need entirely, I suppose one might even be able to make a reasonable cost basis of not being too much of a hit, but if, like with wind and solar until there's sufficient grid movement to avoid some of it, there still has to be that standby reserve to pick up the demand when not there or lose grid reliability. Likewise, have to still have the ICE option too or lose the flexibility.

Reply to
dpb
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From what little I have read it seems that the batteries may be made out of materials that are in short supply in the earth. It is one thing to make a relative small ammout of car batteries, but will there be enough materials to make millions of the batteries ?

Reply to
Ralph Mowery

I am pretty sure I heard the guy say that charge at a Tesla station amounted to 10 cents a mile.

For a long highway trip the Subaru Crosstrek I am driving would cost about 6 cents a mile for gas.

Reply to
invalid unparseable

Lithium and cobalt are two big ingredients but supposedly new technology will be better. Meantime, cobalt mines are providing low wages for kids working in them.

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Reply to
Ed Pawlowski

Yes.

But are very poor value even if you only ever buy new cars and are a lot more hassle even if you always charge at home overnight with no real advantage in use and real downsides in the depths of winter and the peak of summer

Reply to
Joshua Snow

Most of us are looking at the fiscal value. The greenies are willing to pay to save the planet. Others are willing to pay just for the feeling of superiority that goes with it.

I did drive one on a hot summer day and was impressed with the AC capacity. No idea how it affected distance as I only drove it a few miles. My daughter had a Chevy Bolt as a loaner when her car was in the shop.

Reply to
Ed Pawlowski

Even my old 97 Honda Prelude, with me driving it like I stole it, in town, does about 7.5-8 cents a mile on $2.10 gas. "In Town" here is still ~60 with a light every mile or so. On the interstate it is a little better but I am doing 80 and maybe a little more.

That is one thing that made the kit idea not make a lot of sense. The kit was lead batteries tho. Practical range, the way I drive, was 40 miles or so if giving yourself some reserve to get home if you guessed wrong. For most of my days, that would work but I wasn't going to go to the range in Punta Gorda and Tampa was out of the question. Running over to the Cape for something was iffy.

Reply to
gfretwell

I agree. If you just have a beater you are going to the store in, or driving back and forth 15 or 20 miles to work, it could be electric. That is when you get the calculator out ... unless you just think bragging rights are worth something.

Obviously I don't judge my self worth by what I drive. It is just a piece of metal with wheels and a motor to me. I outgrew that after I had my obligatory Corvette. I was happier with the Jeep I traded it for.

Reply to
gfretwell

Running heat and AC comes down to simple physics. A car AC system is around 2 tons so you can compare it to a modern domestic 2 ton inverter system, because that is what it is. Heat is even easier, They may be able to scavenge some heat from the motor and battery discharge and it may use the AC like a heat pump but if you are in Fargo with the heat on in February you are not going to "Far Go". At least not as far as you go on a spring day with the windows open. The AC affects mileage in an ICE car too.

Reply to
gfretwell

Doesn?t effect the range enough to matter tho.

I does with any electric car.

Reply to
Joshua Snow

I did my calculation on $2.20 gas. Currently I am getting 30 mpg around town but have seen as high as 40 on a 50 mile round trip highway. Not bad for AWD.

We also need to keep in mind that the states claiming use of gas tax for highway maintenance are not giving up these fees and like Ohio can just charge extra for registration of an electric car or hybrid like Ohio's current $100/200.

I will never buy an electric car.

Reply to
invalid unparseable

Sure -- in China. Some of the rarer elements are already playing a part in geopolitics like petroleum has.

Reply to
rbowman

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Having significant amounts of lithium could attract a lot of the wrong kind of attention as the big players try to get their hands on it.

Reply to
rbowman

Wintertime in Montana could see the revival of a 100 year old idea:

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They would need their own gasoline source.

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iirc some Beetle owners went to gas fired heaters too when the air-cooled engine was a bit too cooled.

Then in the summer you switch technologies:

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Reply to
rbowman

I went the other way and traded a Firebird for a F150. It's the only time a car salesman ever questioned if I was really ready for a lifestyle switch. They had to do some stuff to get the pickup ready and he insisted I leave the Firebird and take a Lincoln loaner for the weekend. He was worried I'd come down with buyers remorse. I still have the F150 after 34 years and a lot of miles.

I'll have to admit I thought about a Camaro this spring but finally bought another Yaris. I've got the bikes if I want to go fast enough to lose my license.

Reply to
rbowman

I have a large car and came in at .08 on a recent 2400 mile trip.

I'd buy an electric under two conditions. It would be a second car and the price would have to be comparable to an ICE. Years ago when I lived in the city it would have been nice to have something the size of a Smart for around town and parking. Sometimes small is good. Had a Smart For4 for a couple of weeks in Italy and it was OK there.

Reply to
Ed Pawlowski

Only because there isn't a charging station on every corner like gas stations.

Reply to
gfretwell

It is ironic that they call them swamp coolers because they are useless in the swamp. In Nevada, maybe you got you something.

Reply to
gfretwell

No we went the same way. I traded the Corvette FOR the Jeep (1972 Commando) The salesman was the same way but he was happy to take my money. The guy who bought the Corvette called me. (he found a business card in it). The car had been wholesaled and by the time he got it they had shined it up real nice, fixed the exhaust system (both mufflers were missing when I traded it), put in a new radio and did some body work. I got $1200 for it and he paid over $3000. I only paid $4400 new. He really wanted to match the speedo with what I remembered it to be. He was a little disappointed when I told him the 69,000 miles was really 169,000. The speedo had rolled over once but nobody had tampered with it. The Jeep was the last new vehicle I ever bought although I got my wife a couple. I went from the 72 Jeep to a 71 Gremlin I got for free and a $1000 72 Econoline as my other vehicle about the same time. I put a rebuilt engine in the Econoline before I ever really drove it. I was still on the road for $1500 or so total after I did a couple other things it needed. I put 100k on it. Put 50k on the Gremlin and still got $500 for it.

Reply to
gfretwell

I went the other way. We rented a full size Korean (Kia, Hundai?) SUV in New Zealand and parking was tough. The spots were not big enough and it was always over the line.

Reply to
gfretwell

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