PAT / safety-testing - domestic lighting?

You should go through the CE assessment process, in which you would address possible issues such as electrical safety, mechanical stability, flammabil ity, suitability for various environments, toxicity of materials etc. With that done you may affix a CE sticker and sell it.

ses from you.

I or II? And are your shades lead soldered?

I'm fairly sure leaded solder is not permitted under ROHS. If the bulbholde r is earthed the luminaire is class I, if compliant. Someone else can comme nt on the shade.

NT

needing to determine if it complies with class I. Or legally vulnerable.

yes, it's in case the user fits a new plug.

and caution to not cover the bulb I guess.

NT

I don't think that "shan't bother" comes into it. A bit of wire or a connector couldn't pass the visual inspection anyway. Portable means that it must have a connector attached.

You cannot test wire or a connector under the remit of "portable appliance testing"

As a matter of interest how do you propose to connect your piece of wire to the appliance tester, poke the cable ends in the socket with matchtails?

AB

Well, I don't see any pat testing stickers on the lamps in shops, well none of my sighted friends do but most have a sticker on them iec or something similar, most however seem to be two core leads with double insulation but otherwise it is a bit of a mystery. Maybe if you got the design approved that would be that, its only because its home made that the problem arises. Brian

In that case I'd better shut up shop! I would hope that there's a distinction between the use of leaded/unleaded solder in electronics, and leaded solder in traditionally-made craft items....

HI Brian Well - my assumption for the past ten years was that by buying in a CE-marked assembly (mains plug / cable / switch / ferruled wire ends) and connecting it to another approved part (the bulbholder) that I was covered for electrical safety....

As I say, I've no problem with buying in a PAT tester, and running a safety-test on every lamp (perhaps a total of 20 or so per year) - in the unlikely event that a customer (or a retailer) gets a bit litigious.

If nothing else it would provide reassurance that, despite my advancing years, I can still get the green wire screwed safely into the earth terminal and the other two wires successfully fitted into the bayonet connector terminals.

Better safe than sorry, eh? Thanks Adrian

Agreed, but if the OP is buying in compliant materials this can be recorded in his documentation. What a PAT and Megger test shows is that it is wired up appropriately.

Going off at a tangent, might some of the difficulties be avoided by using SELV lights and power supplies?

Ignore the idiot.

He trawls the internet for technically oriented jargon but is clueless as to what it actually means.

The pillock is obviously under the impression that BC fittings have to be soldered onto.

You could post a thread asking if stained glass is class 1 or 2, but that would be cruel :-)

Any chance of a link to a photo of your merchandise?

One would be very interested in seeing the subject of the discussion.

Regards

AB

Even better! I think I could successfully argue that one.

you tell us. gov.uk is a good starting point for uk legislation.

NT

There's a few examples here

Most of them are made-to-order - though I do have quite a few 'out' with retailers for customers who want to buy there & then.

es, so while PAT testing would demonstrate a useful level of safety, it doe sn't really demonstrate full compliance. As examples, voltage rating of mai ns wire is not addressed by PAT testing, nor is copper plated steel mains f lex conductors.

that the materials are compliant will be part of his assessment. But of cou rse he needs to do more than that.

NT

Yes - lower voltage is an option - but starts to open a whole new can of worms, from the customer's point of view. (Like how to replace the 'light-bulb' if the lightbulb is now a string of leds or led tape or whatever. I did convert a client's 'Tulip' lamp (one of those with 12 individual hand-blown glass lampshades) from 110v to 12v, with socketed led 'bulbs' - but replacements aren't all that readily available.

I've just packed up a 3ft6" square leaded-glass panel with a lightbox frame, which will be en-route to the client tomorrow dinnertime. Uses 4m of led tape in ali extrusion with a diffusing cover and a (CE-marked!)

Sorry to say that the panel is made with lead came, and soldered together using lead solder. Perhaps I should make a big warning sign saying 'Do not lick!' Probably the bigger hazard is dropping the thing on your foot - it weight about 30kg!

Green? Where are you getting your cordsets from?

Owain

A PAT tester will not provide you with a "get out of jail" card if something happens.

Complying with every regulation under the sun is no guarantee that the HSE will not prosecute should an incident occur.

The law states that all reasonable precautions need to be taken to protect life and property. A PAT test is just a convenient route to a commonly accepted "standard". Following the procedure to the letter is like following the 17th edition, it is a statement that you are testing to the current acceptable standard.

On the plus point most legal bodies would lose their enthusiasm for prosecution should you prove compliance.

At 20 or so a year, cant you just ask a maintenance worker at a local factory to do a few for you?

If you need to do it yourself, it does not mean you have to buy a dedicated PAT tester, but you would need to have a meter and power supply and to fend off any problems later, you need a cal cert for the meter.

Finally I can recommend the PAT testing course run by City & Guilds, it's quite comprehensive and if you are fortunate enough to get someone who sees it as a bit more than a sticker pasting operation, it can be very interesting.

One I did yesterday ;-)

AB

On Friday, 2 February 2018 19:40:10 UTC, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wro te:

nt & CE declaration is for a lot of items.

e. You should go through the CE assessment process, in which you would addr ess possible issues such as electrical safety, mechanical stability, flamma bility, suitability for various environments, toxicity of materials etc. Wi th that done you may affix a CE sticker and sell it.

chases from you.

ass I or II? And are your shades lead soldered?

holder is earthed the luminaire is class I, if compliant. Someone else can comment on the shade.

I particularly like the blackberry and some of the fused glass.

I don't know if leaded glass is exempted under RoHS. A quick google just br ought up glass used in electronics. Maybe you don't need to, but if you do would there be a problem changing from lead & leaded to unleaded solder for the stained glass shades?

NT

PS I don't know what's going on with Tarquin. He plainly has not grasped wh at I claim, or knows what I do. Nor knows electronic basics like how to cha rge a lead acid battery. And makes weird comments about a mains lead being an appliance & soldering to BC lampholders. Hey, life's too short. Good luc k to him.

I'd be inclined to stay away from extra low voltage for the lamps where mai ns is perfectly practical. If I were a customer I'd find it offputting.

The law on retail products is getting very strict now. The good news is it' s not usually hard to achieve compliance, mainly a matter of reading the va rious hoops to jump through.

NT

Many thanks, they look good. I will keep the link handy. Frankly 20 or so a year surprises me, you should spread the word more.

I was at Cork airport Monday, I assume you are near there?

Birmingham to Cork is a bit of a routine trip for me these days.

AB

From a safety point of view you may be better off fitting low voltage lamps with a wall wart.