OT: How the electric car revolution could backfire

http://www.rationaloptimist.com/blog/electric-cars/
Bill
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One thing that never seems to get a mention, is the heating in these vehicles. Surely the need to heat winscreens and passengers for around six months in the year adds a considerable penalty to the battery life.
Or do we have a return to "Esso Blue", with a greenhouse heater :-)
On the plus point, I can see a ready market for all the fuel saving gimmicks that were on sale years back. The Fuel conditioners can have the piping replaced with cables so that they become power conditioners, a comeback for the 0.22uF capacitor masquerading as a wireless filter unit also, the blurb will be astounding "stop your miles being eaten away by stray RF interference, fit a miracle suppressor" Maybe the green felt marker used to draw a ring on the perimeter of CD's can be poshed into service aroung the charging socket.
Of course the dashboard chargers wil be pushed hard, no one will ever be at risk ofbeing helplessfrom the power dying again with a pc cell on the dashboard, the hundred or so uA will "soon" have them zooming into the distance.
Mind you the true power saving ideas will have been bought up and kept secret by the power companies........
Business will boom!
AB
On Thu, 27 Jul 2017 03:26:22 +0100, Bill Wright

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Its been mentioned in here quite a bit and harry has spelt out the detail.

Yes, but its nothing like that in a real car and reduces the range dramatically.

And to the range as well.

Yes, some do, and that makes a mockery of the alleged antipollution benefits given that that's much worse than with the best IC engines.

You'll end up completely blind if you don't watch out, boy.

Ditto.

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On Thursday, 27 July 2017 05:36:43 UTC+1, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:

Many electric cars have heat pump technology.
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Look on the bright side. A whole new market for Russ Andrews :-)
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Graeme

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Last night a bloke who bought a couple of Renault vans which were electric was complaining that the batteries are on lease and the company is supposed to replace them when the mileage shows they are wearing out, but he has found that in warm weather he gets twice the range than in cold weather even with no heating of any kind. Renault refuse to give home new batteries so he is going to go to law over it. Personally, I'd just sell the vans to a local delivery firm and buy some hybrids from Nissan. Brian
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On 27/07/2017 05:36, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:

Bring back travel rugs and driving gloves!
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Max Demian

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and "flying" helmets
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from KT24 in Surrey, England

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On 27/07/2017 09:54, Max Demian wrote:

It's the demisting on cold and/or wet weather that will be the killer. That and getting into an electric car,soaking wet and no means of drying out with the heater and air-con.
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On 27/07/2017 16:34, Andrew wrote:

These are electric cars not milk floats.
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Andrew wrote:

Do that before yo unplug it from charging? Even do it before leaving the house ... assuming you're able to charge it where you park it of course.
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On 27/07/2017 05:36, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:

It does... even though the more modern ones have heat pump air con units to improve the efficiency of heating a bit. Some also allow a storage preheat facility that allows you to heat the car while its still connected to the mains. They can presumably do some more with thermal insulation to assist as well.
I would be interested to know how well their AC systems work though since some "normal" AC systems can consume 10 BHP or so, and "wasting" 5+ kW on AC seems excessive on cars with less than 25 kWh of total capacity.
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On 27/07/2017 15:59, John Rumm wrote:

That doesn't actually make much sense. How much gain are you expecting in a car? The AC will have a COP of at least 2 and probably nearer 3 so 5kw is 10+kw of heat extraction. My conservatory only uses 1600W to cool it and that is 5kW extraction. There is a lot more solar gain than a car.
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On 27/07/2017 16:10, dennis@home wrote:

Depends on the climate its in... If you take average insolation at say 1kW/m^2 then you could be talking about 4 - 6kW incident on a larger car's passenger compartment.
(keep in mind auto AC systems are designed for global operation and hence need to be able to cope with a hot day in Dubai as well as a wet weekend in Dublin)

The power consumption on my car's AC I believe is quoted at a peak of about 6kW... that presumably allows for mechanical losses as well though.
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On Thursday, 27 July 2017 15:59:53 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:

Full power is rarely used.
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On 27/07/17 03:26, Bill Wright wrote:

on nail hit head
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“Some people like to travel by train because it combines the slowness of
a car with the cramped public exposure of 
an airplane.”
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That's because Matt Ridley knows his arse from a hole in the ground, unlike all Greenies.
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The Natural Philosopher wrote:

One little phrase buried in there ...
"In recent years we have struggled to build enough power stations for existing users, let alone adding all cars and heating too, for that is the plan."
Since when did the plan include switching all heating to electric?
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Heating for cars, plonker.
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I don't have an attitude problem.
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On 27/07/2017 20:31, Huge wrote:

Not the way I read it.
Gas and Oil, and most solid fuels, are fossil hence not carbon neutral. To be truly green we should not be using them.
Andy
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