Electric cars a step nearer mainstream?

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Reply to
The Natural Philosopher
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In message , at 09:17:30 on Tue, 27 May 2008, The Natural Philosopher remarked:

"The S-Class car, a 'mild' hybrid that will still draw most of its power from petrol..."

Reply to
Roland Perry

You clearly did not read it all.

Reply to
Doctor Drivel

"Electric cars have other environmental benefits: they do not produce the particulates associated with burning fossil fuels. The American Lung Association found in a study that switching to electric cars in California alone would save at least $2.2bn (£1.1bn, ?1.4bn) a year in health costs related to people's exposure to fine particulate matter from conventional cars and that 300 cases of premature death, 260 cases of chronic bronchitis and more than 7,000 asthma attacks could be avoided each year as a result. They are also less noisy."

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install a main charging system and larger batteries for the Prius giving an extended range. As batteries get better, merely by changing the batteries, to a different type and a larger bank, the car can be transformed.

These people are going the right way. Look at:

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Reply to
Doctor Drivel

"Electric cars have other environmental benefits: they do not produce the particulates associated with burning fossil fuels. The American Lung Association found in a study that switching to electric cars in California alone would save at least $2.2bn (£1.1bn, ?1.4bn) a year in health costs related to people's exposure to fine particulate matter from conventional cars and that 300 cases of premature death, 260 cases of chronic bronchitis and more than 7,000 asthma attacks could be avoided each year as a result. They are also less noisy."

formatting link
install a main charging system and larger batteries for the Prius giving an extended range. As batteries get better, merely by changing the batteries, to a different type and a larger bank, the car can be transformed.

These people are going the right way. Look at:

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Reply to
Doctor Drivel

Roland Perry gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying:

Indeed.

But do Lithium Ion batteries provide the step forward that's being alleged?

Not really. One litre of petrol provides 35MJ of energy, about 10kWh. Even a small car will have a c.50 litre fuel tank, something the size of an S-class nearer double that.

So that's 0.5-1MWh of energy on board. Wonder how big the battery pack would have to be to replace that...? Wonder how long it'll take to recharge...?

Unless and until that's addressed, pure-electric cars can only replace internal combustion for short-to-medium journey use.

Reply to
Adrian

Which is the vast amount of car journeys. That is why hybrids answer the current problem. Battery for town, petrol for longer.

The electrci Mini answers much of the problems. I gave the link.

Reply to
Doctor Drivel

"Doctor Drivel" gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying:

...and the easiest ones to replace. It's also NOT the vast majority of total vehicle mileage. It's probably a minority of total mileage and therefore fuel use, especially when you include the fact that the "average vehicle" is probably larger for long journeys than for short urban journeys.

No, it's why hybrids answer the wrong question.

Woo. Two mile range at a pace an out-of-tune 2cv could beat, then the petrol engine's needed to charge your Pious up again.

...an even wronger question...

Reply to
Adrian

The current problem is people use their cars for town.

Reply to
Longshanks

The message from The Natural Philosopher contains these words:

Europe but diesel now accounts for about half of the market and carmakers are looking elsewhere to cut their emissions."

Now what emissions would they be then?

I thought the article was all about reducing carbon consumption but ...

Reply to
Roger

In my opinion, yes.

You forget that that energy is converted at less than 27% peak efficiency, propably less than 20% average.: its nearer 95% with battery electric, and with regenerative braking you get a little free recharge.

In reality 50Kwh will do a couple of hundred miles on a commuter car, and probably abut 200Kwh is enough for a big saloon

And the answer to how big that is, is well under half a tonne for the smaller one.

Which is in fact what the majority of car journeys are. And indeed on longer trips an hour recharge time for driver AND car every 200 miles is not actually a bad thing!

My opinion is that the technology is JUST good enough to use for large scale replacement of IC across the board in the next ten years. Especially if attention is paid to the rest of the vehicle weight- and aeodymamic-wise.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

I disagree,. Sub 200 mile trips account for probably 95% of al domestic motoring and about 50% of commercial motoring.

Since your basic assumption is wrong, I cant really say more than 'you are wrong with your conclusions'

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

In message , at 10:41:35 on Tue, 27 May 2008, Roger remarked:

What they probably mean is that by introducing cleaner diesels (in the particulate/smog sense) they have persuaded new buyers to pick a diesel

50% of the time, but that market is now saturated and if they want to further reduce their *carbon* emissions they must look elsewhere than sell people the better-mpg diesels which have been achieving that goal so far.
Reply to
Roland Perry

Electric cars from non fossil generated electricity will cut both carbon and other emissions?

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

In message , at 10:50:09 on Tue, 27 May 2008, The Natural Philosopher remarked:

200 miles is a very large threshold. I'd use 50 miles as where "long distance" starts.
Reply to
Roland Perry

I said: "Which is the vast amount of car journeys.", andmost of the mileage too.

You are confused or just plain dumb.

Did you read the article? No. Did you read the links I gave? No.

Some mothers......

Reply to
Doctor Drivel

Wrong problem we are looking at. That is a social problem, which does not address the vast inefficiencies of the internal combustion engine - 75% of the energy in the tank is wasted, with life killing emissions.

Reply to
Doctor Drivel

unheated behicle in the winter. Even keeping the screens clear becomes a bit of a problem.

Some earlier electric cars had petrol burners to warm the interior. Is that included in the fuel efficiency claimed?

Reply to
Rod

No, thats a congestion and a carbon problem.

The *current* problem won't happen till the cars are electric BOOM BOOM!

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

The Natural Philosopher gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying:

So how come 1.5kWh only gets the Pious two miles at slug-pace? Yes, that's equivalent to about 60mpg, so it's certainly more efficient than the internal combustion process, but it's not as big a difference as you're claiming.

...or about half the weight of the rest of the car...

An hour to recharge 200kWh?

Reply to
Adrian

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