The grenfell building has a dry riser with hydrants on each floor, so running hoses up the stairs and through doors shouldn't be necessary, but use of the dry riser requires parking a pump in one specific location at the base of the tower, and there were photos of vehicles/skips blocking that access during refurbishment ...
In message , at 08:08:47 on Mon, 3 Jul
2017, Andy Burns remarked:in a different tower block (sorry if that wasn't clear)...
...and whose dry-riser outlets were only on every other floor.
And reports that even without temporary builders' crap, maybe the pumps couldn't get that close anyway.
The planning application access statement says
"The fire strategy for Grenfell Tower requires that the Fire Tender be parked close to the entrance to be able to connect to the dry riser in the lobby and pressurize the hydrants at each floor"
I suppose it may not be correct, but it doesn't say every other floor.
In message , a t 08:34:48 on Mon, 3 Jul 2017, Andy Burns remarked:
in a different tower block (sorry if that wasn't clear)... in a different tower block (sorry if that wasn't clear)... in a different tower block (sorry if that wasn't clear)...
Yes I saw your later remark about it being a different tower, but your comment "every other floor" can be read as a direct reply to my "every floor" comment ...
It's something the unofficial resident's committee brought up when the council decided to close the original access road. Leaving only a narrow and often blocked lane.
All the blocks around here that I have been in have two sets of stairs. They are a lot safer than grenfell was.
The council needs to make sure people don't do stupid things and evict them if they continue to do so.
So you agree then.
In message , at 20:35:08 on Sun, 2 Jul
2017, Andrew remarked:Classis swiss cheese phenomenon.
plus tenants being allowed to bring their own ancient untested white goods into the building, plus it taking half an hour to turn the gas off at the main, plus the stairs being too cramped to get sufficient firemen with extended breathing apparatus up and down, plus perhaps an unconscious resident on the floor halfway through a fire door[1], plus no sprinklers, plus work to box-in internal pipework not yet finished, plus cars parked blocking the fire-lanes, plus what appears to be quite a delay in calling the fire brigade after the fridge explosion, plus the fridge being in 4th floor flat not a 24th floor one, plus dot dot dot.
(About the only thing that probably didn't contribute was the absence of gridlocked rush hour traffic meaning the initial engines taking more than six minutes to arrive).
[1] What do people want - closers so fierce they'll chop a person in two?In message , at 09:09:43 on Mon, 3 Jul
2017, Andy Burns remarked:It was an earlier remark.
No, that's what putting...
... in the middle of a sentence means.
Yes you armchair experts that now know what the system was designed to cope with. You should head the enquiry.
Maybe /you/ use magical jumping ellipses, beyond their normal meanings of omission or aposiopesis ...
Overly strong closers are the main reason people prop them open. Solvable with electromagnet catches.
NT
In message , at 09:32:32 on Mon, 3 Jul
2017, Andy Burns remarked:
You jumped to a wrong conclusion. Get over it.
How do you know? Grenfell was thought safe - until this disaster. Two sets of stairs both full of killer smoke isn't going to be any better than one.
Ah - right. Blame it on the tenants. Say no more.
In message , at
01:34:57 on Mon, 3 Jul 2017, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com remarked:
Doesn't solve debris in the doorway.
In message , at
09:16:01 on Mon, 3 Jul 2017, "dennis@home" remarked:Unfortunately, it has a duty to house them.
Eh? Just who is going to test and approve the design of white goods? Since the government and council rather obviously couldn't even make sure a safe cladding was used. A much easier thing to assess than white goods.
Doen't solve the question of whether ET exists either.
NT
which it could do for the antisocial ones in their own separate location.
NT
A PAT tester would reduce fire risk. I doubt they could stop tenants owning PAT fails, but advising them would reduce the number of failures in use.
NT
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