Pentair to sell tool division: Delta, Porter-Cable

[CW]

Yes, everyone knows what you mean.

[RB]

You'd best not say such blasphemous things in the south. Don't you know that evolution is a dirty word? ;-)

I read a fascinating book a while back, "The Surprising Archaea: Discovering Another Domain of Life" by Professor John L. Howland of Bowdoin College. In it he presents the most compelling argument in support of evolution from they type of event that could give rise to your primordial stew. An enjoyable and very informative read.

RB

Everett M. Greene wrote:

[David Hall]

So obviously you shoukd just give up and suck in a little welfare because this mean old businessman isn't willing to pay $20 an hour for $5 an hour work. And we wonder why immigrants, legal or illegal, are sought after. That attitude - more than the low wage - is the reason. "you owe me" seems to be the low skilled low educated american's mantra.

Dave Hall

[Henry Bibb]

Lotsa precise machine work used in makin' them nukes...

[David Hall]

So where did I say it was a solution to anything. I simply asserted that is the FAR more likely senerio than a protracted battlefield war if either side came anywhere near to losing or suffering major causualties. I don't like it, I never invented the damn things, but they certainly changed the mathmatics of major wadfare forever.

What does that have to do with a war that uses up all of our manufactured war materials to the extent that we cannot make replacements - which was the premise of the OP and why he said national security demands that we stop importing goods to support a national manufacturing base so that we can make war materials when we get into the next big war.............

Syria?

[Mark & Juanita]

In article , [e-mail] says... ...snip

Slight? Slight my butt! Every time I call DirecWay satellite support, I have to struggle to understand the Eastern Indian accent trying to talk to me.

Yeah, they're really, really good at apologizing and saying they are sorry.

[Mark & Juanita]

In article , n7ws@_arrl.net says... ... snip

You know, I understand your frustration. But, much as I despise what the Republicrat wing of the Republican party has done, I can't imagine having somebody like Dean or Kerry (who voted to cancel the F-15, the F-

14, the Patriot missile system, the Aegis missile cruiser system, cut funds to the F-16, the Tomahawk missile system -- i.e. every major defense system in our inventory) in charge of our defense. Especially given the current environment with Al Queada continuing to plan additional attacks on the US.

[David Hall]

Now at first I was assuming that he was talking shortly after the "big bang" so that the relatives were (I guess) just some form of energy. But then I realized he said "year" so since we use that term to describe time based on the earth going around the sun, he must have been talking about when that dust cloud first started coming together and circling that new star. I guess we were cosmic dust particles at that point. Of course he could be a really conservative Jew and be talking about 6,000 years ago or so - but no, he doesn't seem too religious. I don't know, but my last immigant ancestor that I am aware of came here from England around 1768 - although there are a couple of gray areas in the mid 1800's that could have been some newbies. And yes, there are a couple that apparently immigrated during the ice ages since I am supposedly about 18% "native" american.

Dave Hall

[Mark & Juanita]

As a 4'th generation descendant of German immigrants I know that the first generation, while preserving their traditions and language at home and within the private Lutheran schools they started, also worked to learn the language of the land to which they had migrated.

A major difference between sending money to help your relative migrate and sending money to support your relatives in their country.

I never said or indicated otherwise.

You are attributing attitudes and comments to me that I never said nor implied.

Your comment above regarding the comment that immigrants are no longer net producers but are now net consumers of other peoples' money belies what you just said here.

and what

[Silvan]

I agree and I agree, but it's hard to do better. I'm going through an "I hate my job" thing, and I just got done looking through the want ads. Since I don't have 40 years of administrative big business management experience, and my Linux experience is useless because I'm not a kernel hacker, that cuts out everything that pays better than $15 an hour. The only jobs that pay in the $15 range are trucking related. Everything else is in a sort of bell curve with minimum wage on the bottom, and $10 an hour on top. Most of the jobs fall into the $7 range, but the curve is a little heavier on the $5 end than the $10 end.

Not much choice at all, though there are about four dozen trucking jobs to choose from. Three dozen of them pay better than the one I have, but I'd have to live on the road. The other dozen pay less than what I already make.

I guess it's time to be grateful I have a job, and stop worrying that I'm wasting my education. Nobody's looking to hire anyone with an education in anything other than business administration, and I can't imagine anything more mind numbing.

Plus, I like it here. I have roots. I have a house. I'm not moving. In today's economy, you can't make any money unless you're willing to chase the job. Take a job in Some Yonder, and wait for them to move you to Some Other Yonder.

Forced relocation sucks. I think it has a lot to do with today's culture where nobody knows who his neighbors are, or cares.

[CW]

What? We're shooting spitwads now?

certainly changed the mathmatics of

[Unisaw A100]

Interesting that you bring this up as I was pondering a similar line last night during some of my "I don't have to be thinking of useful stuff right now" down time. What's different, at least for me is, this is one chapter of the Great Delta Legacy that I'll/we'll be able to watch first hand.

By the way, the finance guys arrived at Delta shortly after the sale of the company in 1939. Now it's rather interesting that during that time and well up into the next couple of decades the engineers and sales force at Delta managed to keep them at bay (some what). By the mid-70's they (engineers at least) had been pretty well beaten down and the new world order was in place. This wasn't the beginning of the end as that had really begun rather benignly years before but it certainly accelerated Delta's demise.

Oh hell yes. Delta is Jet's stiffest competition though stiff in this case may not be the right word. The game was Delta's to lose and they lost it. Plain and simple, game over man.

DeWalt is one thing but Jet has pretty much built their line on the back of the already available Delta design. I suppose you could make a case-by-case argument but let's face it, they only backwards engineered the Delta line.

I'm thinking the jury is still out on Powermatic and that only time will tell.

some snippage...

My AMF/HD argument has always centered on the fact that without AMF guys like Teerlink and Bluestein (sp?) would never have had a company left to rescue. The same might be said for Penthair though I don't think Penthair is to blame as much as Delta's internal management. It's a blurred line I know but from what I have seen an owner doesn't always hold the cards and it usually comes down to the people doing the actual work.

Oh hell yes. Now, may I?

I'm thinking Jet is turning their pockets inside out right now and looking at all available avenues to buy the Penthair Machinery ConGlomCo. It would make them instant players in the markets they don't already have a foot in (Porter-Cable/DeVilbis/et al). It allows them to make Delta dead should they decide that to be a good thing. After all, there really isn't a need to have two of everything. Least of which it buys up Delta's distribution and customer base though they already seem to be everywhere that Delta is.

This would be no different than Delta and Rockwell buying up Walker-Turner, Crescent, Red Star and all the other great woodworking machinery makers that have fallen by the wayside but had/have made Delta what it was once upon a time.

A'yup, we have a front row center seat here for the next chapter of the Great Delta Legacy.

UA100, off to make popcorn and scrunching his ass down in the big comfy chair...

[George]

Sort of like saying "unwed mother" instead of "single parent," is it?

Or in line with the discussion - "illegal alien" versus "undocumented migrant."

Anyone but me get Diane Ravitch's _The Language Police_ for Christmas?

It reminded me of my class in early Stalinist literature, except I could laugh at it then.

[Bob Schmall]

" There does seem to be a difference between the immigrants of days gone by and many of the current immigrants. The ones from days gone by wanted to *become* Americans and build a better life. They adapted to their new country while maintaining their family traditions within their own households. Many (please note the word "many" not "all") of the current brand of immigrants are seeking a better life, but not with the desire to assimilate into society -- look at the preponderance of languages in which California ballots are printed -- they want our society to adapt to *their* traditions. Much of the money that is made by many of the illegal immigrants is sent back to their home countries."

This is your original post. Note that it is loaded with generalizations and contains very little evidence.

Nope. I am opposed to granting citizenship to illegal immigrants, in part because we can't afford it and in part because they should be held to the same standards as those who have gone before. My reaction to your post was based on the vague and unprovable comments you made about the motivation of today's immigrants. Pick up a book on the history of immigration (even if it's only one) and you'll find that immigrants to this country are the MOST motivated of their people. Who else would take the huge risk to seize the opportunity?

Very few of the posts on this thread look to the American businessman, who will go offshore in an instant if it means lower costs. Yes, our lifestyle expectations are too high. Yes, our leaders are doing nothing. Yes, we've become complacent. Yes, Yes, Yes. But let's not forget to add the contribution of businesses addicted to short-term profits, union-busting, extreme executive compensation, and insular thinking. Example? My son works for a major government contractor. The company will not institute a quality control program anywhere near the industry standard, because they would rather send high-priced engineers out to fix production and design problems. I ain't naming names, but my son is looking at his options.

The whole business of "Exporting America" as Lou Dobbs calls it, is far too complex for a history major like me to figure out. One part of the solution must be to become more realistic about the status that we as a nation are seeking. We aren't going to be the leaders of the world, but that's OK. A good example is Italy, which leads the world in cooking and fast cars but not much else. Are they unhappy? Hell, no--they love life and in general have reasonable expectations. Americans are too driven by their need to be number one and to have it all.

(soapbox mode off)

Bob

[p_j]

Uh, the tax code is replete with welfare programs that require higher levels of income to qualify.

Even in the middle it is a virtual non-stop "you owe me."

I'm sure if this off topic discussion went on and you were to reveal your deductions and examined the services you received, your argument would be that they were owed to you.

[Brian Elfert]

The state of Minnesota is building their first light rail line in Minneapolis.

The designers originally decided to go with two languages for the ticket machines, english, and I think Spanish. The Somali community got all upset that Somali wasn't added as a third language. I think the Somalis got their way and several hundred thousand was spent to have Somali added to the machines.

They should have just put english on the machines and left it at that. Next time around, the Hmong, the Chinese, and the Indians (From India, not native americans) will all want their language on there too. Pretty soon, one ticket machine will take an entire wall to include all the instructions in different languages.

Brian Elfert

[Bridger]

Pretty soon,

nothing a little well written software can't take care of.

we'd all be richer for it.

[Jeffrey Thunder]

I think it's worth pointing out that, unlike Delta, Jet was no a tool manufacturer. If I'm not mistaken, Jet didn't have any manufacturing facilities until their acquisition of Powermatic. For that matter, did Jet aquire Powermatic, or was it their parent corporation (whose not-so-memorable name I forget)?

Hmmm..... I'm not so sure. Would it really be in their best financial interest? Sure, I can see a definite benefit. But would that benefit be worth the cost? Would it be like Ford buying Chrysler or Daimler-Benz (sp?) buying Chrysler?

Well, I think it would be a little different. Again, Jet is an importer/marketer of machinery, not a manufacturer. Do they want to go that direction? Sometimes corporations do best sticking to what they do best, so to speak.

I think I'll wait for it to come out on video.

[Phisherman]

I'm an experienced software developer, now unemployed. Bush says I should change jobs, but software is what I know and have been doing for 30 years. I could go back to college, but by that time I'll have

8 more years to work until retirement. Right now, I have no insurance and no plans to buy anything. I can't blame the government for my situation, but I hate Bush telling me the solution is "to change professions." I won't change my work, but I will change my vote!

[Morris Dovey]

Hmm. Ok, but that doesn't sound like much of a plan. I developed software for over 40 years (see

and for an addendum) and opted not to compete with Indian labor rates. We both need to do /something/ productive with our lives!

I've always loved woodworking; and I've had an increasing interest in alternative energy technologies since the early 70's so I decided to produce solar heating panels (browse around at

and fill in with contract CNC work for local cabinet shops (who don't have terribly strong software/computer skills) to keep my navel separated from my backbone. I don't know if the plan is a good one or not - but I think it'll work better than watching my saving be eaten up by the inflation that the Bush administration set us all up to experience over the next ten years.