Snooping TV.

On 11/03/2017 11:57, tim... wrote:

IME that is far from true - I have seen very few that don't support some kind of firmware upgrade capability. Whether it ever gets used is a completely different matter though.
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On 2017-03-10, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

If the TV can be voice controlled, it must be able to separate speech in the room from stuff coming out of the TV itself, right?
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Think there's a difference from recognising a clear command to understanding all speech.
Although I've never actually tried the voice activated side.
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Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On 10/03/2017 13:55, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Unlike for voice command processing, the TV does not need to understand the "bugged" speech - only upload it.
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On 10/03/2017 18:33, John Rumm wrote:

The TVs tend not to understand the speech and do the same as apple and M$ ie. the upload it to a server for recognition.
So if you want to listen in you can hack the server as long as the user is using the voice recognition. If they have disabled voice recognition in the menus then you need to hack the TV.
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On 10/03/2017 18:42, dennis@home wrote:

Most of them seem to do a bit of trigger processing, so they know when to start uploading, then do the grunt work in the cloud.

Which was the object of the exercise being discussed I thought?
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On 10/03/2017 23:15, John Rumm wrote:

That's good because that's what I thought too. So going by ARW and TNP you must be wrong too.
I like the way tim posts saying that you can't hide from being seen on the router and snips the bits where I say how it can be done. I suppose that's the way it goes, some just like to pretend they know about things.
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On 10/03/2017 13:55, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

If you are spying you don't need instant recognition of what was being said. You can spend a lot longer post processing a recording using different algorithms to build a composite 'picture' of the conversation.
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Yes. You can spend a lot of time writing all this special software to bug all our TVs. You can then spend a lot of money capturing everything that is said anywhere near them. Then spend even more time and money deciphering everything said. In every language too, obviously.
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Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On 12/03/2017 13:21, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Why do you suppose they collect all SMS messages, to do nothing with them? Why did we have to build in ways of remotely intercepting calls on SystemX? If you are a person of interest then the cost is not really going to matter. If you are of no interest then you don't cost much.
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Because it is already needed - as part of the normal transmission system?

Something which cost pretty well zero.

Ah. So you only do this with 'persons of interest'. If you already know they are of interest, no earthly point in attempting to snoop on everyone else?
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Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On 12/03/2017 15:31, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

You don't have a clue how much software and the extra hardware costs do you?
You probably believe the TV programs where you can only trace calls if the hang on the phone for several minutes too.

You do understand that not everyone has a smart TV to bug anyway. Its just one tool available.
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As part of the design and specification of an entirely new system? Peanuts.
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*I got a job at a bakery because I kneaded dough.*

Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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On 12/03/2017 15:31, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Well right there is one of the big areas of debate. There are many that advocate collecting everything all the time, in the hope that it might be useful later - much like the way they claim CCTV "prevents" crime - when in reality all it might do is make it easier to solve after its happened.
There are many who would like to data mine that collected information and draw value from it (be it intelligence, or marketing)
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On Sun, 12 Mar 2017 15:31:15 +0000 (GMT), Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

with

Store and forward. Once forwarded why keep them? Same with historical location data, the system needs to know where a phone is *now* to work. It doesn't need to know where a phone was yesterday, let alone last month or year.
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On 12/03/2017 13:21, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

You have just given some control freaks an orgasm ;-)
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On Fri, 10 Mar 2017 12:59:23 +0000, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

I believe the exploit required physical access to the TV. So spooks would need to break in to set it up. (Which is nothing untoward. As Peter Wright said in Spycatcher: "we bugged and burgled our way through London").

When my (Android) phone is on charge*, if you say "Google" in a normal voice, the mic manages to pick it up and trigger "OK Google" - gave me a hell of a start when it first did it.
*There's a setting in Google Search for "voice control","OK Google", "On when charging"
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Now put it beside a TV with the sound at normal level, and try telling it to do that from the normal viewing seat.

Voice control isn't that new. Getting it to work in the midst of other chat - especially if that chat drowns you out - would be impressive.
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Dave Plowman snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk London SW
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Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Mine usually works when the phone is in my pocket and I'm driving "OK google, navigate to home".
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On 10/03/2017 15:05, Jethro_uk wrote:

Yes, indeed, has to be modified physically - IIUC it can't be done with a software hack. Same with the webcam on my Mac computer. I hope :-;
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