Competition for SawStop ?

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On 1/23/2011 10:06 AM, Steve Turner wrote:

In custom home building/remodeling, when the client takes it upon themselves to go into a flooring store, a tile store, a window store, a cabinet accessory store, an appliance store, a ... ad infinitum, you end up spending half your time convincing clients that what they were told by a salesperson, in order to get a sale, is not even close to reality, as in:
"Sure, that $800 stove vent liner will work just fine above your new $7,000 stove. No, you don't even need a vent hood, just have your builder install it in a cabinet, no problem!"
Yeah, right ... <first 13 photo's is how that works>:
http://picasaweb.google.com/karlcaillouet/DurretteKitchenShopPictures?authkey=Gv1sRgCIaJgYOqgKvOVw #
And perhaps worse ... when they _are_ the salesman themselves, as in the situation when they see something on the internet that:
"... will work so well under that bath vanity that I ordered it!"
Nuff said ...
:(
--
www.e-woodshop.net
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http://picasaweb.google.com/karlcaillouet/DurretteKitchenShopPictures?authkey=Gv1sRgCIaJgYOqgKvOVw #
Wow I see that the drawer parts were cut to length in the UK!
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Would those nice people do that?

Y'mean the -extra- $500 commission he makes on 1 Sawstop sale? (WAG)
-- "I probably became a libertarian through exposure to tough-minded professors" James Buchanan, Armen Alchian, Milton Friedman "who encouraged me to think with my brain instead of my heart. I learned that you have to evaluate the effects of public policy as opposed to intentions." -- Walter E. Williams
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@swbell.dotnet says...

However only a naive person thinks that expensive gadgets will make them "safe".
The question is what constitutes an acceptable risk. You seem to be able to tolerate less risk in your life than most people.

And having a Sawstop doesn't guarantee that he won't have an accident. Might not cut his hand off, but that doesn't save him from tripping and busting his skull on the table edge.
If you aren't trying to sell anything then quit acting like people who don't spend every cent they have buying safety equipment are doing wrong.
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I get a kick out of how people unwittingly broadcast their bias. By using the term gadget - a dismissive term, you are doing simply that - dismissing anyone else's rationale.
You seem to be the only one that has come to the conclusion that _anyone_ feels a SawStop is a). a "gadget" and b). supposedly infallible and foolproof. Nobody at any time in this thread or any other thread on this topic has said it "makes then safe." It makes them safer - no quotes needed.
You may have noticed that big red paddle switch down by your knee on the TS - does that make you "safe" or "safer"? Are they a bad idea in your opinion? How about GFIs? Eye protection? Condoms? Jails?
Incremental improvements in safety add up.

Most people? You've obviously polled a large number of people to come to that conclusion, or conducted extensive research to back up what is otherwise just another guy with a keyboard's opinion. So, please provide your vetted reference material or at least acknowledge that many people opt out of your "most people". The acknowledgment is really not necessary as it's abundantly clear you have no clue what most people's risk tolerances are, the methods they use to evaluate them, etc., etc.
You also - surprise! - conflate risk and cost. The cost of a SawStop or any other safety item is independent of the risk, right? If the cost of the SawStop, or other such technology, was right in line with the cost of a competing quality TS without that technology, or at least close to it (yes, close is a relative term, but deal with it), do you think that would change how many people opted for the safer technology? The risk of having an accident hasn't changed, just the price.
I obviously do not care what you do in your own shop, and you should not care what I do in mine. If you don't like the progress in technology, you are free to use your 1940's TS, drive your 1964 Rambler and post from your Commodore 64 through your 14.4K modem. No one will force you to sell them.
If you must argue emotionally, don't be obstreperous about it and at least try to have a sense of humor. Thanks.
R
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(and patent license). SCMSs do it. I'm really surprised table saws don't have at least dynamic blade braking.
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Only the $99 chop and mitre saws can afford to have dynamic braking.
Spin-down can be taken care of a *lot* more cheaply than a SawStop mechanism (and patent license). SCMSs do it. I'm really surprised table saws don't have at least dynamic blade braking.
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Reminds me of when my son was a pre-teen and wouldn't wear a helmet or other protective gear while rollerblading because he didn't plan to fall! But as he grew up, he learned the meaning of "accident".
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wrote:

In my 35+ years in construction, I have known many like you.
It gives me great pleasure to see them all manner of injuries large and small that could have been easily prevented if they had used available safety equipment.
Their injuries, especially the serious ones, are a visible testimony to their commitment to their pride and sense of righteousness.
Go get 'em Larry!
Robert
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With some thinking a 3.25" nailgun won't fire a nail out of the nailgun more than 2", it's no wonder we have these stupid accidents.
In my 35+ years in construction, I have known many like you.
It gives me great pleasure to see them all manner of injuries large and small that could have been easily prevented if they had used available safety equipment.
Their injuries, especially the serious ones, are a visible testimony to their commitment to their pride and sense of righteousness.
Go get 'em Larry!
Robert
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On 1/21/11 3:03 PM, Josepi wrote:

You sure are a glutton for punishment, aren't you.
I believe your actual delusion was that said nailgun could inflict bodily injury at a range of 1/4 mile. It's still bull$h!t, btw.
--

-MIKE-

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wrote:

bull$h!t.
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On 1/21/11 3:54 PM, Doug Miller wrote:

They're both bull. He wouldn't see it, nor would it be there to be seen.
--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
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wrote:

Go get 'em Larry!
I have, for the last 25 years, been working with machinery, 40 to 70 hours a week, that could rip my arm off or worse. The damage they could do would make a tablesaw injury seem like a paper cut. I have never so much as lost any skin. Your construction anecdote is not even relevent as far as I'm concerned. Different situation entirely. On the average construction site you have a large number of, if not the majority of, guys that have IQs just a bit higher than a 2x4. All in a hurry and most never having been trained in safe working proceders.
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Those early Apollo crew members that were burned up in their capsule during testing,,,I think they were pretty well educated and trained.
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Wasn't their fault either.
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snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.nett says...

However they knew going in that they were doing something far more dangerous than using a table saw.
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Do you think it was their fault?
Max
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snipped-for-privacy@sbcglobal.net says...

Nobody _made_ them climb into a pure oxygen environment on top of 3000 tons of high explosive all built by the lowest bidder.
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wrote

They chose to take the risk. They know what they were dealing with. Same with the shuttle crews, it really does not matter whose fault it is, the fact is that they chose to take the risk.
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