Best Grooves

[Lew Hodgett]

Way back when I was still living in Cleveland, would catch JP McCarthy in the morning on WJR.

Also, the station in Windsor was neat.

My how times have changed.

Life goes on.

Lew

[Robatoy]

I know my Grundig at home will pull it in, I hope my blaster at the shop will too. I'll give it a try.

Thanks, Bill.

[Tom Watson]

thread cleanses the group and brings up both the similarity and its opposite in terms of taste.

My initiation of the thread was about base line grooves, which I figured that Swing would jump on but that most would leave more or less alone. I thought this to be obvious from the initial selections.

I'm happy to see that my intent was misunderstood and that the product is far more excellent than a strict adherence to the intent would have produced.

Since we seem to be talking about the baddest possible jams, I'd like to add:

Damned near anything that Joe Pass ever played.

Damned near anything that McCoy Tyner ever played.

Everything that Wes ever played.

Everything that I've ever heard Django play.

Everything that Ricky Skaggs ever thought about playing.

Any mandolin played by that kid from Nickel Creek.

Mingus...Mingus...Mingus.

Steve Stills, when he's really on.

CSNY when all the high notes ring.

The entire Buffalo Springfield Again albumen.

Dylan - for fooking ever.

That wonderful blonde woman from Canada who did almost every song that I liked in the mid seventies. (the wind is in from Africa...)

Canadian Railroad Trilogy.

The Last Of The Red Hot Burritos album that has the best version of Six Days On The Road that was ever recorded.

Leonard Bernstein for his scoring of West Side Story.

Vangelis for his scoring of Chariots Of Fire.

Tom Waits.

Warren Zevon.

Well, we're at the Z's. Let the rest pass for now.

Regards,

Tom Watson

tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet (real email)

[Robatoy]

On Nov 22, 7:48 pm, Tom Watson wrote: [schnipfered for brevity]

Base lines ...or bass lines *G*..Like Taxman, Paperback Writer, Drive My Car, Ticket To Ride..

No bass, no base. A good rythm section will drag the rest of the band through to recovery after their biggest screw-ups.

Robbie Shakespeare, Jaco Pastorius, Victor Wooten, Les Claypool. Saw David Jacques a few weeks ago with John Prine, excellent.

here's some Wooten

[Don Fearn]

I think it was "Robatoy" who stated:

-Don (a fan of Victor's)

[Joe Bemier]

But, it would be my opinion that Sir Paul M is not among them. I feel that Lennon was the genius.

[Robatoy]

Lennon & McCartney were prolific pop-tune generators. Their understanding of what the market desired was probably the best ever. It was Harrison who was the 'genius'..and Riongo was a FAR better drummer than anybody gave him credit for. Just saying...

[Dave Jackson]

Anything with a tambourine, especially Motown. --dave

I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?

[Joe Bemier]

Thats an interesting POV - I cannot disagree. And, I'm not sure why, but drummers never seem to get much notice.....except maybe that dude from Blink 182 who's got that babe and all...:) My point is based on Lennon's post Beatles work compared to Paul's. Imagine and other work of Lennon have a genius to them. While Paul's work is marginal at best. I believe that if Paul were not a Beatle, his work would be canned. But, JMO - and I am not much of an expert in music - just an avid user.

[Mike Marlow]

I'm not sure which part of this to take vehemant exception to Robatoy. For starters, Lennon and McCarthy were'nt pop tune generators. Well - not after Sgt. Pepper anyway. They didn't understand what the market wanted, they pushed the market into new sounds and expressions that the market had no idea were out there. They were nothing if they weren't drivers of music. Like Hendricks, they were forces in changing the course of the market with radical and unexpected music.

Harrison was a great musician and both schooled and talented, but a genius he was not. He brought a discipline to the Beatles with his jazz roots and his structured playing but he was as predicatable as the sun rising every morning. His song writing was nice, but not genius. If anything George was the foundational, or stabilizing force within the band.

As for Ringo - I'd agree that he was better than the worst of his reputation as a drummer and he did have more schooling and background than many knew, but it was easy to not recognize that Ringo had that background since his playing was so bland. Not like an artisitic underexpression - just uninspired drumming. He had more knowledge of what to do with drums, but in my opinion, he was as bad a drummer as he is accused of having been - simply because that's how he played... badly. It does not matter what he knew - he played badly. That's a bad drummer.

... and I love the Beatles. Go figure.

[Robatoy]

On Nov 23, 8:51 am, "Mike Marlow" wrote: For

I would have to give you that the Beatles as a package was a driver to the industry. The helm of which was firmly in the hands of George Martin. McCartney wrote pop. Period. In many cases, Martin turned that into music. Lennon had passion, and I still believe him to be one of the best 'blues' singers. Man, that dude could convey pain. That 'Imagine' drivel was cute in a 'protesty' way, musically very bland. The song 'Woman' was more of the same. McCarney's path, post Beatles was 'Wings'.. 'nuff said.

Bite your tongue. He was a stabilizing force because he was rock solid. He would always have a nifty lick to spice up the otherwise bland L&McC 'creations'. The whole mystic side came from him. He made them hip in their day. Take a good look at Harrison's catalogue and hold it next to the pop-drivel of McCartney (When I'm 64??")... Give 'Something' a close listen again and we'll talk about Harrison as a foundation some more. Don't confuse Harrison's image with his talent. I can perceive The Beatles without any one of the other three members, but not without Harrison. I guess we see things differently. That doesn't make me right.

He just happened to play in the best band in history. He was good enough for the Beatles. But it is hard to shine when all you do is play pop tunes written by the likes of Lennon & McCartney. Moon and Zak have seen other sides of him.

So do I...go figure. (But having said that, Michael Jackson's Thriller still sets my foot a-tapping too. I like pop. Good pop.)

>

[Swingman]

Might have been for the best with McCartney on bass. The drummer better/MUST be able to please a bass player who also happens to be a/the driving force in the band, regardless of whether the drummer is "inspired" or not.

IOW, unless the drummer started the band, or can _really_ sing either lead or harmony, he won't last long if the bass player doesn't like him/can't play with him. ;)

Personally, I much prefer an "uninspired" drummer who can meet me on the top of the beat and shake hands, over one who is "inspired" but doesn't quite 'feel' a groove the same as I do.

The band sounds better as a result. I see/experience this quite a few times a month playing with different drummers, but with the same core group of players who have been playing together for ten plus years.

In the same vein with the Ringo thing ... what is notable is that the best bands are greater then the sum of their parts ... trite but all too true.

A band only needs one outstanding musician to be "great" ... four competent musicians, and one world class musician pulling them along, historically make better bands than five world class musicians.

Best proof of that "rule": Creedence Clearwater Revival ... worst musicians on the planet, PLUS John Fogarty.

And further proven by the many iterations of "all star" bands who's music ends up well executed, but with no soul/drive/excitement.

I know I'm preaching to the choir with you, Mike ... I just had the opportunity to chime in my tuppence between turkey basting. ;)

Have a good Thanksgiving!

[Don Fearn]

I think it was Tom Watson who stated:

yadda, yadda, yadda . . . .

I recently read about a bus that crashed. Killed in the crash were the driver, four musicians, and a drummer.

BAH-DA-BOOM!

[Tom Watson]

Yeah. The original that was sent to me had different musicians for the jokes and I changed them all to drummers.

Sorta like those all purpose ethnic jokes where you just plug in the group that you decided to offend today.

Of course, I don't really dislike drummers.

I really dislike ukelele players.

Regards,

Tom Watson

tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet (real email)

[Robatoy]

On Nov 26, 4:44 pm, Tom Watson wrote: [snip]

O RLY? Check this out Tom.. and get back to me.