OT MSSE XP end of support nagging screens etc

With the demise of Microsoft support for Windows XP, they seem to be indulging in scare tactics in order to sell new systems. Time will no doubt tell if the security risks are really as great as they say.

One of the tactics they have indulged in is to create a new version of Microsoft Security Essentials whose prime purpose seems to be to direct you to a web site counting down to end of support, and which also makes the tray icon never display protected any more, no matter what you do.

These two things can be very irritating, so I decided to see if it was possible to downdate Microsoft Security Essentials.

I first tried the obvious wheeze of uninstalling it and reloading the last version from an archive obtained from the file site, filehippo.com.

This fails as it seems key parts are not uninstalled.

However, I discovered that if you then run Eusing free registry cleaner, which is a free program, you can get rid of all the left overs, and the old version of msse can be installed. Also, if you have or get the excellent program, Revo un installer, and use that programs advanced mode to uninstall the new version and then restart the computer, you can load the last version of MSSE straight away with no hassles.

OK so we are back with the last version of the anti virus. It will still update itself with definitions, and according to information from the Microsoft web site, it should also mean that you are going to be pretty well protected until July 2015 now. Of course they say that without the hotfixes and other updates, XP will at least in theory, be left open to hackers. Time will tell.

If you do not want XP to load the crippled version of Msse at the next update, then you need to go to the windows update web site, search for updates, and stop the Microsoft Security Essentials update for xp being shown, downloaded or offered again. There are two checkboxes, one to be unchecked, and one to be checked.

Of course every time you update, Windows will remind you you hid a critical update, but I'm sure we can live with that.

It remains to be seen whether they send it again in April 8th update, which will be the last.

However if I read the Microsoft web site right, in addition to the MSSE definitions updates, you will get updates to the malicious software removal tool every month as well, until July 2015. They tend to hide this bit of info in their documentation rather as of course they want to get people to change their operating system.

March 2014

? ?

Brian

Reply to
Brian Gaff
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That's not the obvious solution. Using an out-of-date version of a security filtering app is kinda pointless.

The obvious solution is to use a different product entirely, one that MS can't use as an advertising vector.

Reply to
Adrian

The short answer is that no one really knows what the impact of the move is going to be, since there is no real precedent.

The last time MS stopped supporting an OS it was Windows 2000, and at the time there were very few remaining users (significantly under 1% of the user base). This time it will be nearer 30%.

To an extent I understand why they have done this, since many users are rather clue resistant when it comes to getting the message that support is ending.

It would seem far more sensible to uninstall it completely and switch to one of the free third party offerings - certainly safer than running an out of date version of MSSE.

These are relatively recent concessions (along with the deal to keep releasing patches for group licensing customers who are prepared to pay[1]).

To an extent they are also about "protecting the herd", since any remaining (internet facing) XP machines on corporate networks in effect lowers the protection of the rest of it.

[1] If you are a large customer (1000's of seats+) then you have the option to pay for XP patches for the next year at $200/machine (rising to $400, then $600 in subsequent years)
Reply to
John Rumm

Well, we _do_.

IE8 & XP won't get any more security patches released.

IE's easy enough to work around - use a different browser. XP - well, there ain't THAT many security patches being released these days anyway. Only criticals. So the only time there might be an issue is if there's a new exploit released. If you're using non-MS security apps, then they'll pick up on 'em quickly enough, so it remains as pretty much that zero-day window of vulnerability.

Reply to
Adrian

To the home user 10% of bugger all. Decreasing to 5% of bugger all behind a NAT. Never installed an XP update beyond installing SP3 and not had a problem. It's a bit like the endlessly over-stated virus protection - yes there's an endless stream of harmless adware and hard-to-shift toolbars to collect but I haven't seen a real virus since "I Love You".

Reply to
Scott M

Most of the risk these days comes from vectors where NAT and firewalls in general have little impact - they are typically attacks launched from inside the perimeter defences by either trojan bearing applications willingly installed by users, or exploits that target any number of layers of the browser / plugin stack via compromised web sites. Hence any feeling of security that comes from the anticipation that "the nasties can't get in" is usually misplaced.

Savvy users are the best protected in that they are less likely to fall for phishing style attacks, and possibly take more care with what they install, and also the options they select when installing stuff.

Which suggests you have not really being paying attention.

The nature of malware has evolved certainly - the "I am going to delete all your files for the fun of it" virus is certainly less common. However the "I am going to co-opt your machine into a botnet" style is still big business. The "I am going to hold you to ransom" style malware is a growing industry.

Win XP is still the target OS of choice for malware writers commanding a much greater proportion of infections that its remaining user share would indicate.

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Finally don't underestimate the damage that can be done with toolbars are other browser helper objects.

Reply to
John Rumm

You must lead a very sheltered life then. I see a few virus and trojans affecting friends and neighbours every year. Not just on XP either Vista also has its fair share of serious vulnerabilities. If you are the curious sort that clicks on things with attachments just to see what is inside then life is about to get a whole lot more dangerous.

I expect that a lot of naive users won't notice that they are a part of a botnet until their internet feed is suddenly cut off by their ISP.

We won't have long to wait to see if a botnet firestorm ensues... it could be worse than the great mass mailing Swenfest of 2003. (and at some point in the future it probably will be)

BTW I am inclined to agree that some of the latest AntiVirus products have become almost as annoying, invasive and obnoxious as the malware that they are supposed to be protecting us from.

Reply to
Martin Brown

That's a valid point. I can't point to my experience of a seeming total lack of 'consequences' of the end of extended support, just over

3 years and 4 months ago, of windows 2000 as an example of what to expect with an EoLed winXP.

Or even an up to date version. Microsoft themselves have admitted that their own product isn't quite 'up there' with third party AV suites and is supplied as a form of protection on the basis that "It's better than nothing at all".

That's unlikely to make any difference if you already run a third party AV product.

That's the main reason why extended support has lasted as long as it has for this OS.

Even at that pricing, many large businesses will see that as a small price to pay to avoid all the consequent costs of an upgrade to win7 or worse, the dreaded win8.1. They might see it as a way of avoiding win8.1 altogether in the hope that win9 goes back to a properly thought out desktop GUI before making the jump.

Reply to
Johny B Good

Yet another reason to forget windows

NT

Reply to
meow2222

But a (software) firewall (ie not just NAT in a router) can protect against malware making any outbound connection.

I don't grant net access, or automatic 'trust' to run or do anything odd to any app except those I use frequently. Those that I use less often I'm more than happy always to get a firewall/hips alert for, when it runs. So long as those expected alerts keep coming up, i'm fairly sure that any malware I collect will also cause alerts.

Of course if someone dismisses every alert without considering it carefully, they will have very little protection.

Reply to
Jeremy Nicoll - news posts

In theory it could (assuming the malware in question does not simply shut it down).

However there are weaknesses with locally installed software firewalls; the first is the daft popup which says "process xyz is trying to talk to the internet - do you want to let it", to which most users simply say "yes" since they have no way of knowing what should and should not be allowed to talk. Alternatively, the malware is a browser helper object / plugin of some description and communicates though the browser process which has already been granted safe passage through the firewall.

Some will, and you may spot it. Some will run under the guise of an already trusted applications however.

Indeed, and this is the usual problem. Even the ones that start out being ultra cautious learn their lesson when they mistakenly firewall off all their web and email traffic, and have to call for help to get back online. ;-)

Reply to
John Rumm

Not really, as one knows the performance of msse, and as they will not be updating the engine and the current engine is exactly the same as the last one except for the nagging and lack of protected status, you might as well go on using it. No other third party anti virus is going to be supporting XP in new versions, and from my own viewpoint there are none that are blind friendly these days anyway. Just so you know. Brian

Reply to
Brian Gaff

Indeed, and many are taking that route (even those that do ultimately plan to shift to Win 7 but started the process too late)

Yes, it will be interesting to see what that is like and how long it will take ;-)

Reply to
John Rumm

Yup, you will feel safer... but when the shit hits the fan you then get to wade through lots of pages of posts by geeks telling you you were dumb for installing the wrong distro.

Multi platform malware is getting ever more common:

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Reply to
John Rumm

java IS a trojan...

Reply to
Tim Watts

In article , Brian Gaff writes

If you select the custom install, there's a tick box that says "Do not remind me about this update again"

I'm not sure it's MSSE that does the nagging. One of the updates last Tuesday was to install a nagger to remind you about the end of support. Needless to say, I unticked that one and checked the box to not remind me about it again.

That said, I upgraded my home XP Pro system to Windows 7 Pro without hassle using a 13 quid educational licence DVD. It took a while but the result works very well and it retained all my installed apps and a plethora of tweaks and customisations.

Reply to
Mike Tomlinson

Anyone care to recommend a free antivirus for XP that doesn't use too much of the computer's resources?

Reply to
DerbyBorn

In article , John Rumm writes

Plus millions of machines running pirated copies of XP in China, India and other third world countries which don't get security patches applied because they're pirate copies. Those are going to become one massive botnet.

Reply to
Mike Tomlinson

Thanks for the heads up Brian. I have an XP lappy logging data at the moment and it is out of my wifi range and keeps bleating about MSSE updates. I will prevent updates as you suggest and hopefully avoid the situation you got into.

I had a quick look at one of the linux flavours as a possible alternative to XP but it was just unfriendly/unfamiliar enough to make me decide to be lazy and to continue with XP come what may.

Reply to
Bob Minchin

Did you have to jump through many hoops for that Mike? I always maintain that you never stop learning so maybe I'm still being educated ???? Bob

Reply to
Bob Minchin

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