OT: Contactless card fraud?

[ss]

[Dave Liquorice]

A quick play with NFC Tools indicates it doesn't gather as much info from a CC as NFC TagInfo but can write tags(*). NFC TagInfo can read passport info as well, not that it works with my phone. Either lack of power or a time out.

(*) "tags" you can buy writeable RFID tags or stickers. These can store a small amount of data which when read by a phone can do all manner of things. I have one that I wave the phone over when I get home, this gets Trigger to tell the phone to turn on Bluetooth, turn off Wifi, enable data and launch a task(*) that turns off silent, set a divert to the land line and changes an icon to show the mode the phone is in.

(*) Via tasker.

[newshound]

Interesting.

NFC Tag Info will read something from a bus pass, a Tesco bank card, a Barclaycard, or a Barclays debit card. It gives an error message with an Oyster card. When presented with a stack of cards, it will sometimes succeed in reading one. But that is wiping the reader directly against the cards, or on the outside of the wallet holding them. I think I would recognise being wiped that close to my crotch. But equally, perhaps they are not quite so secure as I had assumed.

[Andy Burns]

NXP also do a TagWriter version

Years ago (when the Nexus7 first came out) the TagInfo app wasn't by NXP Semi, it was by "NFC research lab" and there was a passport plugin for it.

Have you tried the ReadID one?

[Roger Mills]

In what way am I wrong? Why do you think that card companies are pushing contactless cards? What I meant was that fraud compensation was a lot less than the commission they get from contactless transactions, so it's still beneficial to them - and hang the customer who ends up with fraudulent transactions on his account, some of which he may not notice!

[Roger Mills]

Indeed. But I was talking about the card companies' profit - not the retailers'.

But, come think about it, encouraging customers to use contactless cards rather than cash probably increases the retailers' profit too - which rather reinforces my point.

[PeterC]

I had to shield mine anyway as they were interfering with the bus pass. I made a 'wallet' of pie-dish aluminium, so quite thin, which cured the effect. I keep the BP in the back pocket of the wallet/purse, then all sorts of cards and an Innox 'Swiss army' card between the bank cards and the BP, but still the bank cards were a problem. Looks as if about 8mm+some metal wasn't effective. Tha ally wallet is a bit easy to squash, so would a couple of sheets of about ¼mm titanium do the trick? Also, from this thread, could the chip be scanned edge-on?

[Andy Burns]

Search "EMV PPSE" for some bedtime reading?

[newshound]

When I was younger, I probably accepted your view that we were all at the mercy of nasty organisations who put profits above anything else.

These days, I am more inclined to accept the old Adam Smith argument about market efficiency.

What actually matters in this context is reducing transaction costs. Money helps, because the fisherman no longer has to negotiate with the blacksmith every time as to how many fish he will have to offer to get his horse shod. The extension of this is that banking with debit cards makes things easier, and (for small, quick transactions like bus-fare), contactless makes it easier still.

Both the retailer and the bank have to make some profit, otherwise they go bankrupt. Market forces mean you don't get ripped off, because you get to chose the cheapest service. If some other provider thinks they can supply this more cheaply (and still keep body and soul together) they will.

[Max Demian]

I don't think anyone has proposed such a thing, but sticking a ticket in a slot and taking it out of the top doesn't take much longer than 'showing' an Oyster to the machine.

[Dave Liquorice]

After you've spent several minutes in a queue to get your ticket.

[Jethro_uk]

Very likely ... as a schoolboy in 80s London, Ken transformed public transport beyond belief.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Except that you have to buy that ticket. Before you use it. An Oyster card etc can be topped up at your convenience.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

I take it you've gone to this trouble because you've lost thousands through the card using itself?

[Davey]

Ken did that when he was still a schoolboy?

[charles]

Actually it does. and the tickest sometimes jam.

[Tim Streater]

I do buy that ticket. At Ashford railway station usually.

I actually own an Oyster card now, that the niece gave me. Prior to that all my London journeys have been on a Travel card.

[PeterC]

Exactly the opposite of course - because I don't want it to be scanned. Rather like keeping my wallet in a non-obvious place and never in a rear pocket. Also, as I said, it was necessary to avoid interference with the bus pass.

[Andy Burns]

You don't need an oyster card, you can just use any contactless card, make sure you use the same one to tap in and out with, and for all journeys made in the same day.

[charles]

but that's now. Initially, you had to use an Oyster Card and later a registered Contactless card.