Hey, Opie (err..ah.., I mean OP),
Your question was answered many times, and then answered again after you posted more info about what you apparently incorrectly considered to be a "service disconnect" on the outside -- the meter box.
While I know you can be quite a character here sometimes, it is not really like you to not realize that your original question was already answered many times over.
Makes me wonder if you are having a bad day, or a bad week, there in Mayberry :-)
Over here in the colonies we take that 240v and center tap the transformer so both ungrounded legs are 120v above ground. That still gives us the ability to use 240v equipment but most ends up being
120v. I suppose we can blame Thomas Edison for that. He started a fear campaign against Nick Tesla over AC current, Edison wanted DC and he said AC was more deadly, to the point of electrocuting an elephant along with more than a few condemned prisoners ... all with AC. When he lost the war, the deadly part still stuck and the belief was that 120 would be safer, still leaving the option of having 240v equipment.It is interesting that you only have 11kva transformers. Typically here, a single home would be on a 25kva, the smallest generally available. Two houses get a 37 and 3 houses would get a 50. That is about the max on a single transformer. Distribution will be
13kv to ground (3 p wye)This is a 50
You can see 2 of the 3 drops going off to the houses
And those 50's blow up quite spectacularly during ice storms.
5 days without power. Gave me the chance to start the aquarium over from scratch. :-(
More wires and outlets all over the house, inconvenient I guess.
No, 11kV, not 11kVA. I meant the voltage going into their primaries.
We actually have much bigger ones than yours then, the one opposite me serves about 100 houses. It's very large and when it was replaced I saw them unload it off a flatbed lorry, it took up half the trailer. In case flatbed lorry means nothing over there, this big:
What is an "ice storm"? Is that the same as a "hail storm"? Our transformers never seem to break.
Surely you could have found enough juice to heat an aquarium?
Why are more outlets "inconvenient"? In fact our code requires that you are pretty much never more than 6 feet from a receptacle, not crossing a door or other opening.
240 equipment is generally going to be fixed in place anyway.I will say that in my travels I was impressed with the 240v tea kettle, if you really make that much tea.
OK my fault. I had understood that you folks did distribution from centralized transformers. I think we went will smaller transformers and maintaining the medium voltage for distribution because our homes tend to be farther apart. The I2R losses from 240v distribution over many hundreds of feet would be substantial. What is your typical load calculation for a home? We have a minimum service requirement of 24KVA (100 amps) and 400 amp services are not uncommon. They do build a 125% cushion in that calculation and the required feeders are only 80% of that calculation for the entire load of a dwelling. I am sure Americans still use more power than you folks across the pond but isn't that our way ;-) My usage ranges from about 2 MWH a month to around 2.5 MWH when the AC is on. That is between $200 and $300 with all the fees taxes and other charges. It is an "all electric" house tho, including pumping water. I have no other utilities.
I thought 240 was indeed more deadly than 120 and that more people died of shocks, per capita, in the UK than here. How could 240 not be more deadly than 120?
Isn't it the case that if either of them goes through your heart it can kill you? Anything over 80 volts or something like that is all the same.
The only difference is that much higher voltages can burn your skin, or jump across gaps where you least expect it. But that's kV.
Because of the two different types. If I want to plug in a hoover, I us= e any outlet. You have to find one of the right voltage. So to make it= as likely to have one, you need twice as many outlets.
Why on earth would convenience be in your code? I thought "code" was fo= r safety?
So what are your kettles? 110 volts and 1.5kW? That would take an age = to boil. Or do they have a 30 amp flex?
What about an iron? A portable fan-heater or convector heater? There a= re loads of appliances which need a lot of power that you may wish to mo= ve about.
e serves about 100 houses. It's very large and when it was replaced I s= aw them unload it off a flatbed lorry, it took up half the trailer. In = case flatbed lorry means nothing over there, this big:
We get 240V at 80-100 amps. I for some reason have a 100A master fuse, = followed by a meter which has a rating of 80 amps. I've seen some old m= eters that say 60 amps. However the wire coming into my house is quite = substantial and could probably take 300A if I told them I needed more, a= nd they could just change the fuse and the meter.
If we're not in the middle of nowhere, heating, hot water, and cooking i= s done by gas (it's 3 times cheaper), so we don't use that much electric= ity. Showers, washing machines, and dishwashers tend to heat their own = water, so those and a tumble dryer (our weather is very damp) are about = the only things that wil use much.
Looking at my last bill, I used 1.5MWH between April 25th and Oct 11th, = which is several times less than you. WTF are you doing with all that p= ower?
Now you see AC isn't needed in the UK :-)
Here, 2.5MWH would cost =A3340 =3D $480, about twice what you pay. Why = is America cheaper for everything? There's a phrase "rip off Britain" b= ut nobody knows why it's the case.
Do you use heating? Since you said AC, I'm assuming a warm climate. Do you have a swimming pool?
-- =
I went to San Francisco. I found someone's heart.
The ice storm is when the rain fall out of the sky and freezes on the power lines and trees. It can build up to several inches in diameter. Often the ice is more than the tree or some of the big limbs can stand and they break and fall across the power lines. Sometimes could be called freezing rain.
Unlike hail that is already frozen and does not usually stick to the wires and trees. Hail can be large enough to damage things but does not usually take out the power lines.
That's very odd and seems to be against the laws of physics. If it's below freezing on the branches, how come it's above freezing higher up (where you'd expect it to be colder) causing rain and not hail?
The only time we get too much weight on branches is in colder parts (North Scotland) where SNOW falls on things. Snow has the ability to stick of course, and builds up.
Because of the two different types. If I want to plug in a hoover, I use any outlet. You have to find one of the right voltage. So to make it as likely to have one, you need twice as many outlets.
Why on earth would convenience be in your code? I thought "code" was for safety?
So what are your kettles? 110 volts and 1.5kW? That would take an age to boil. Or do they have a 30 amp flex?
What about an iron? A portable fan-heater or convector heater? There are loads of appliances which need a lot of power that you may wish to move about.
We get 240V at 80-100 amps. I for some reason have a 100A master fuse, followed by a meter which has a rating of 80 amps. I've seen some old meters that say 60 amps. However the wire coming into my house is quite substantial and could probably take 300A if I told them I needed more, and they could just change the fuse and the meter.
If we're not in the middle of nowhere, heating, hot water, and cooking is done by gas (it's 3 times cheaper), so we don't use that much electricity. Showers, washing machines, and dishwashers tend to heat their own water, so those and a tumble dryer (our weather is very damp) are about the only things that wil use much.
Looking at my last bill, I used 1.5MWH between April 25th and Oct 11th, which is several times less than you. WTF are you doing with all that power?
Now you see AC isn't needed in the UK :-)
In the US most common items that plug in use 120 volts. The standard current is up to about 15 amps. Good enough for small electric heaters to warm up one room. Washing machines are usually 120 volts and do not heat the water, dryers are 240 volts and have a special plug for that, same as for the electric stoves and ovens. Irons are 120 volts, but not many use them now. Coffee pots, microwaves, and toasters and other plug in devices for the kitchen are usually 120 volts.Problem is that unless several circuits are ran to the kitchen you can only do one or two things at a time.
Just looking and my bill shows 2,039 KWH for this past month. That is for all electric and I have a well for water. Been using the portable heater for an unheated room in the basement some this winter. The summer bill is not usuall too much less due to AC. Lots less in months we do not heat or cool. The heat is by a heat pump.
The code is for safety. Most items come with about 6 feet of cord, so outlets are usually every 6 feet of wall space by the code. Several circuits for the kitchen area.
I think my main breaker is 200 amps.
Not really. Heaters here are 3kW. You're getting 1.8kW, suitable for a hall maybe.
We used to have washing machines which COULD heat the water, but if you were doing a warm wash they'd take half or all the water from the hot water system, but some idiot has decided to make them all cold fill, citing some bollocks about it's cheaper than having your hot water tank heated up. But at the same time, we've all gone over to gas combi boilers which heat the water on demand anyway! Then I heard some crap about "the washing machine will take cold water from the pipe before it gets there from the boiler", which is wrong because if you turn on a hot tap, it's hot pretty much straight away.
I can put my dryer anywhere I want in the house. I'd find it very annoying to have to rewire the house when I want to move it.
Yes a stove has its own circuit here - 240V 30A.
Ours take long enough to heat up, yours must take all day.
Why would you stop using irons?
What amperage are your outlet circuits? We tend to have 240V 30A for the whole house on one loop. So you can run two or three big things without overloading, never have to think about it.
So to stop you having wires to trip over? That's going way too far with safety, I thought the UK was bad. The only rules we have for outlets is when installed near water, like in the bathroom. For some reason the rules are tighter than the kitchen, which has just as much water!
But then most of us do our own electrical work and just ignore all that shit anyway. My house, I'll have an outlet in the bathroom if I want. If I didn't, I'd only run an extension cord in there anyway.
All the common everyday appliances, eg microwave, electric kettle, lamps, vacuums, are 120V here and those are the only outlets distributed around the house. 240V is used for electric dryers and ovens and it's about the only place you'd find a 240V receptacle in a typical house. Some might have it for some shop type gear, in their basement, garage etc too.
That is part of safety. Having sufficient receptacles within a given distance means that people are less likely to run extension cords which are a known hazard, for example.
~1.5KW is what they are. I would agree, 240V for that would be real sweet. Still the 120V electric kettle can heat it faster than using the range and more efficiently.
They too are limited to ~1500W. There are some that require a 20A circuit, have a different plug, but those are the exception, not typical.
Same here. If nat gas is available, it's by far the most economical. Electric is usually most expensive. We've found a tremendous amount of new nat gas in the last decade or so.
Showers, washing machines, and dishwashers tend to heat their own water, so those and a tumble dryer (our weather is very damp) are about the only things that wil use much.
Here shower and washing machine, in vast majority of cases, don't heat their own water. Electric dryers do and are on a 240V receptacle.
Most houses have central heating so not that much use for the portable heaters. The portable heaters cost more to operate that gas, oil, heat pump systems.
We normally feed hot and cold water to the washing machines and a valve on the machine blends them depending on hot, warm, cold. Most places have the hot water tanks of about 30 to 50 gallons and while there is a push for the on demand hot water, not all that many use it, or not in the area I live in. Usually the washer is not too far from the water heater.
Dryers are not normally moved and placed next to the washing machine which is not moved due to the water lines. Also as the dryers vent the hot air and has lint in it, they are usually vented to the outside of the house. Good for summer and bad in winter.
It does not take all that long for the iron to heat up. Takes too much time to iron the cloths.. Perment press came out years ago. We don't even have an ironing board. The jobs we have just require working and not dress cloths. The wife will put a towel or something over the bar in the kitchen to do some ironing if we relly need something ironed.
Most houses are wired with 120 volt and 15 amp circuits. One good thing about it is that if a breaker does trip it only effects the outlets of one room. There are usually seperate 120 volt circuits for the refrigerator, washing machine and a few other high current items that are not often moved around.
My house has 2 outlets in the bathroom connected to a GFCI breaker in the breaker box.
The house was built around 1980 and I think the code at that time required the GFCI for bathroom and outside recepticals.
There is a large book for the National Electric Code. It is not mandantory for the different states, but most areas go by it or something very close to it. From what I understand there are lots of differentrules for wiring in the country. Some areas you have to have a licensed electrician to do any wiring. Where I live you can do you own wiwring,but are expected for it to meet the code. If you wire for someone as a job then you have to be licensed and have it inspected. I did one wiring at my house that is not to any code. Ran a # 10 wiring from the breaker box on a 30 amp breaker to an outside receptical ( actually a combination) where I can get 120 or 240 volts, but its main use is to hook up a 5 kw generator that I have incase of a power outage.
Where would you want to put it, the living room? Here we generally have an area that set up for the washer, eg water faucets to screw the hoses onto, drain for it, and then the dryer goes right next to it, with a 240V receptacle provided. The dryers are also vented outside, so if you can move yours around, what do they do with the venting?
Takes just a few minutes. Not a problem really. While it's warming up there is usually something else that can be done at the same time, right there.
Permanent press clothes and taking things like dress shirts to the cleaners.
We have multiple 15A or 20A 120V circuits for receptacles and/or lights. Many circuits have both on them. How many circuits depends on the size of the house. But having 12 to 20 of them isn't unusual.
So your vacuum must have quite a beefy cord on it. Our vacuums typically use 5 amps, the the flex is quite flexible.
I wasn't aware America was over the top on safety. An extension cord is not a hazard, what do you think it's going to do? Catch fire for no reason?
I find the 3kW one too slow if it's full.
I think ours is all from the North Sea, which being in Scotland I'm right next to.
Do you still have those washing machines like I saw on a TV show once, where the detergent is dispensed automatically fro a big tank above it?
We don't really have that much 240v equipment and most is fixed in place. The required outlets are all 120v
In the case of receptacle spacing, the safety thing is limiting the number of extension cords used and making it unnecessary to string cords across openings. There are plenty of people who say we have allowed too many things into the code that are not safety related. Manufacturers have a lot of influence in the code process.
120v equipment is pretty much limited to 1440w. Irons seem to function just fine at 1kw or less and we don't really drink that much tea. I am not sure you can even buy a dedicated tea kettle here. People boil water on the stove where they have plenty of power. We really try to avoid the use of portable heaters by having robust central systems but there are still plenty of 1440w heaters around. They cause a disproportionate number of the fires, usually in older homes with bad electrical systems.Pumping and heating water, cooking, heat and A/C, running a spa and a pool. It starts adding up fast I guess Heat is not really an issue but when we do it we have toaster wire heaters. I have not had the central heat on in a couple of years but we do have a 1440w "electric fireplace" in the living room that my wife uses on cold mornings for a little warm up.
I imagine you have a tad more in taxes but we also use natural gas for electrical generation and that is pretty cheap here.
+1
And if you want to use one in say a bedroom, the 120V ones seem to be adequate. I guess with 240V you could heat it up a lot faster, but for maintaining, seems 120V is fine. If you need 240V, heat multiple areas that way, you'd have a hell of a bill, here at least.
They tend to get used for one offs, like the central heating is broken, or you want to dry out something quickly.
Space is more of a problem in UK houses, so having no hot water tank is good.
I have my dryer in the garage out of the way, and it used to be in the kitchen, in two different places as I rearranged the room. I wouldn't want to have had to move the outlet.
Permanent press? What is that? Like a big trouser press thing?
So you can't use two 15 amp appliances in one room? That would be very annoying.
I saw once a picture of double outlet for the USA, where the top one was 0v and 120v and the bottom one was 0v and -120v. So you could get 30 amps total there. I guess you could then even have a 240v outlet in the middle.
My house has fuses. I detest breakers as they trip unnecessarily.
If it's in your own house, who is going to know? It's nobody's business but yours anyway!
Here, we're not supposed to do our own gas plumbing, but I ignore that too. It's no more difficult than water plumbing.
I think they're trying to do that here. At the moment, you can get a certification to be an electrician, but it's not mandatory, and it's up to the customer if they choose someone with one or not (with are more expensive).
Ah, so it's actually an inlet? It would feed back into the house?
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