I suspect an electrician might also recommend either GFCI breakers or
outlets to cover any of the areas that are exhibiting shock problems. If it
were my house, that's what I would do (and did) although I learned the hard
way that I needed to run a separate, non-GFCI protected line to the
refrigerator. DAMHIKT. (-:
You're on an idiot roll this morning, aren't you Trader?
AND THEY MIGHT JUST SAVE HIS LIFE IF IT HAPPENS AGAIN.
Obviously that's too hard for your tiny little pea brain to comprehend.
Fortunately the folks that write the NEC get it and that's why GFCI's are
required by code. Jeez, when you get a hair up your fat, ugly ass, you sure
do lose IQ points. I'm more than happy to help you show how your temper
betrays your intellect.
No one ever said that they didn't. Read my several posts on his need to get
a qualified electrician in to fix the problem and you'll see you just made a
fool of yourself tripping over your own anger. Again. Don't you get tired
of making yourself look stupid AND petty?
If you re-read what I wrote s*l*o*w*l*y this time, you'll see I said the
electrician might ALSO recommend adding GFCIs. The implication is that
after he finds and fixes the current problem, he'll do something to make
sure if it ever happens again, the circuit will be protected and he won't be
shocked in any way.
I guess that's just too much for you to understand Trader. No wonder you
can't understand what Bud was trying to explain about the ACA. You have
some serious mental blockages. Try taking a TSP brain enema to clear them.
(-: Education and patient explanations don't seem to work.
Why do you insist on making yourself look foolish? You actually have a
rather keen diagnostic mind when you don't let your emotions or your
politics make an idiot out of you. Such a tragedy.
On 10/28/2013 08:17 AM, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
True, but if the piping were grounded then B) would be true, *except* in
the instance where it is a neutral wire in an appliance that is
connected to the water piping system not a hot, in which case unplugging
the appliance would "fix" the problem (and it'd be easy to guess which
appliance it is, as the issue would only show up when the appliance was
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
On Monday, October 28, 2013 9:00:11 AM UTC-4, Nate Nagel wrote:
You're making the big assumption that a hot that is somehow
connecting to the piping system is in fact a dead short. That
would trip a regular breaker by exceeding the current. But
more typical is that it's not a dead short from a hot, but
some partial short, ie some leakage current getting onto it.
If it was a direct connection from hot the OP would likely be
on his ass or dead.
Tingling is much better than zapped. Depends on what part of your body is
making the path, and what your wearing. When I was a lot younger, I started
getting tingling in the shower piping standing on cement floor. Turned out
to be bad bypass connection on water meter. Could have been bad for me.
That house was a 1960 model. Wiring code now is much better, but
connections are connections.
Yes, it sure could have! From what I've been reading about the problem on
various websites, the shower scenario is typically the most lethal one. The
supply pipes, for whatever reason (and there are many possible ones) become
ungrounded and energized while the drain pipe for the shower still makes a
good ground. Your naked and wet body makes the circuit complete. OUCH!
There are many possible causes and the water meter bypass is but one of
them. Older houses are more susceptible to the problem because of the
laxity of the older electrical codes and the possibility that any number of
previous occupants have done something stupid.
Fred, if you're reading this, unless you consider yourself very
knowledgeable about electricity, I would defer to a professional at this
point. While I like to encourage people in AHR to expand their horizons and
tackle tough jobs, this is one that is too risky to try to solve on your
own. I would watch what a professional does and ask lots of questions,
though, so I might be better prepared to deal with a similar occurrence in
the future. I bought a house that had been modified by a very amatuer
electrician and the surprises kept coming for years and years. )-;
<many, many lines of double-spaced, useless quoting snipped>
It's called being polite, something you obviously don't know very much
about. Apparently Usenet posting isn't something you know much about
either, seeing you never appear to trim a post when adding only a *single*
new (and often pointless) thought like today's.
In addition, you appear to use an inept "newsreader" (being polite again)
That makes your pointless, untrimmed and often personally abusive posts two
or three times as long as they have to be. You're apparently not even
self-aware enough to notice how crappy your posts look. I can only imagine
the lack of attention to detail that goes into your home repair projects if
you think your posting style is acceptable.
Those faults are in addition to your constant need to go off-topic with
nearly every post you can to satisfy your need to inject your own vitriolic
personal political agenda into home-repair threads. Just like just like you
did with the fence thread, turning it a shot at Obamacare. So really,
Trader, WTF good *are* you? We know you're a very unhappy person and the
world is not to your liking or approval. You don't have to keep reminding
us because most of us know but we don't really care.
somewhere is energizing that > pipe, and the pipe itself is not properly
You forgot a third fault - the OP is a mental defective who thinks making
people believe that lives are in danger is entertaining. Hmmm, where have
we just seen this same sort of behavior before? In a moderated group he'd
be canned faster than a tuna.
Doesn't matter if one of our own is unbalanced enough to play on people's
good natured concern for their fellow man. To our troll's dismay, in the
end I think a lot of good came out of the discussion. I learned more NEC
stuff and so, I think, did a few others.
The best part is that I ended up getting the Sperry tester recommended by
Nate (Sperry VD6505 for $15 from Amazon and free shipping!) and I love it,
somewhere is energizing that > pipe, and the pipe itself is not properly
P.S. I forgot to add that in retrospect yours was the first and best
answer. As the thread progressed and we explored all the potential sources
for energized plumbing, it became clear this was a case clearly too complex
for anyone but an expert. The severe downside for guessing wrong (death)
made the best advice would be to get an electrician or even call the power
Another lesson here is that it is probably always wise to assume the poster
knows less than more about 110VAC electricity and work your way up re:
suggestions when a knowledge level is established through Q & A. We should
have been more suspicious (and Tom R. was) when the answers to the questions
that were asked were not forthcoming very quickly, as they would if someone
were really getting shocked by their faucets.
I would check for voltage between each of your plumbing pipes and the
neutral terminal of an electrical outlet. On a polarized receptacle,
the neutral will be the taller slot.
Notice if your phone rings when there's voltage in the pipe. Telephones
operate on fairly low voltage... except when they ring. The ring signal
to a telephone is a whopping 90 volts AC, which is enough to give you a
pretty good shock.
On Saturday, October 26, 2013 10:20:29 PM UTC-5, nestork wrote:
Our ring voltage was 90v for most of my lifetime but I found out from AT&T that it somewhat recently changed to 45v. I guess the new landline phones have a better ringer than the old rotary dial types.
That is a *damn serious* situation and you need to have a certified
electrician take care of it *at once*!
115vac *can* be fatal!
Do not fool with it.
It appears to be an electrical ground circuit connected to an ungrounded
turn off the main breaker, do you still feel the shock?
if not turn on main breaker and leave all other breakers off....
do you feel shock?
if not turn on one breaker at a time till you find the one that causes the shock
note whats on that breaker and unplug everything ..... do you still feel shock?
if not plug one thing in at a time.......
doing this preliminary work will save the electrician time and you money.
do you remember when troops in iraq got electocuted showering? I wouldnt shower till this is fixed.
although if turning off your main breakerstops the shock then only shower with all power off.
most likely causes, a malfunctioning dishwasher or clothes washer, a garbage disposal, or other electric appliance that uses water.
although a water line might be getting in contact with a power line.
in any case if in doubt get a electrician there ASAP which isnt wednesday.
THIS CAN KILL YOU:(
MOST likely is the electric panel is "bonded" to the water pipe, and
the jumper across the water meter is open. - meaning you have an open
ground and a "live" plumbing system. Leakage to ground in ANY
electrical device will make the system live - not just a "water
However, IF you have an electric hot water heater and it's been a bit
slow lately, you quite possibly have a blown heater element. Shut off
the water heater to prove.
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