.. spin on a new old safety razor ?

[Scott Lurndal]

A very intelligent person can have trouble with math. That doesn't make them not intelligent, just not perfect. Not all college degrees require mathematical skills.

Anecdotal evidence is isn't. (evidence, that is).

Personally, I know quite a few people in the 1%, including many scientists, venture capitalists and CEOs. They're all quite intelligent and don't ever piss in their boots (nor would they have any difficulty doing so were it necessary; as well as subsequently pouring it out).

As I noted, it's a bell curve; you'll find rich folks on either end, although the lower end is generally inherited wealth, not self-made.

assets and buying power (which leverages assets) aren't as different as you think.

My point was that the term 'millionaire' doesn't have the same cachet today as it had when you were growing up, particularly given current real-estate valuations - although as you correctly noted, those assets aren't liquid, they can be leveraged.

[krw]

By definition.

We just this discussion here. One may be able to retire comfortably on a megabuck AND Social Security, as long as you don't live too long. Retire before 65, and you'd better make that two-megabux.

As you point out, $1M ain't what it used to be.

[krw]

I guess one can be brilliant and illiterate, too. That's what Leon was talking about. Not calculus.

At the IQ 80 end, probably not. But 120 is the other sigma. I'm sure there are many between. But, again, the distribution "intelligence" is, by definition, a bell curve. It's the way it's "measured".

Only if there is some sort on "income" that will pay the note. One my former managers had a net worth that put him into your "distant 1%" and retired early. He couldn't get a car loan. The banks just said "pay cash". "If you can't use your money, why should we take the risk with ours?"

[hubops]

Seriously ? ... that does not sound like any bank that I have ever known ! .. not that a car loan is a good idea - except for the bank. I have heard of cases where a person didn't have any kind of "credit rating" that the bank could check - because they never had any credit cards or debt of any kind. .. I think my oldest brother might fit-the-bill. John T.

[invalid unparseable]

Didn't have the megabuck when I retired 20+ years ago, but I was smart enough to take advantage of job offers after I retired - I think I've now retired 4 times ;-)

Being frugal (OK, cheap) and of the DIY persuasion also helps. Had an HVAC semi-emergency the other night - the condensate pump not moving the water and there's water in the catch pan. The pump was semi-permanently installed (PVC drain pipe assembled in place - including the entry to the pump's reservoir) so you must cut the pipe to get the pump out. First some old towels to cath the drips, then drill a small hole in the pipe just above where it enters the pump. No water from that hole so they blockage is in the pump's reservoir of it's above the hole I drilled. Oscillating saw to take the pipe off at the top of the pump housing, then a funnel and pircher to run water through the pump and see what's under the murky water. Two quarts later, the bottom of the pump's reservoir can be seen and the pump works fine. Now the drain pipe is too short to enter the pump's housing but that's OK as there's space for a piece of 2x4 to go under the pump and raise it just high enough to capture the pipe. Three days later it's still working fine - the original installation had the end of the pipe too close to the bottom of the pump's reservoir and the bits of debris (fuzz, lint, whatever) that wash down from the evaporator coil had accumulated deeply enough to block the drain pipe. That pipe now has more than an inch of clearance from the bottom of the pump's reservoir so I shouldn't have this problem again. Other than my time, zero cost for an after hours HVAC repair. What's the going rate for that? Enough to pay for the cordless drill and oscillating saw?

[DerbyDad03]

Not if you use a reverse mortgage.

What was his "net worth" made up of? Totally illiquid assets? Nothing that could have been put up as collateral?

A one percenter that can't get a car loan? I sure would like to hear the details behind that. (I sure ain't no one percenter, but with a 825 credit score, they throw credit card applications at me as I walk down the street.)

[krw]

Seriously. It's not like his assets were tied up, either. It was pretty much liquid (mostly stocks).

"No-low" credit. There are ways around "no", these days.

It's not rare but not advised either.

Credit scores are crazy things. I have a high score (830+) but put a big bunch on my cards one month, a vacation, new wedding for SWMBO, jointer (the OT part ;-), and I don't remember what all else. It totaled about 10% of my availability but I always pay the cards off every month. It still hit the numbers about 20pts., not that mattered. I can see how it could be a big deal for many, though.

[krw]

Well, sure. I was "retired" 15 years ago but still work. Working isn't retired.

It's worth it! Plumbing and I don't get along at all. Whatever I touch, breaks.

[krw]

A 1%er isn't likely to go for a reverse mortgage. There is a place for them but it's not a 1%er.

Almost all securities. He was a quite successful "player", which is why he wanted the loan in the first place.

You have income, no?

I hear you. When we bought my '13 F150 (now in the great pick-a-part in the sky) and my wife's '14 Mustang, a week apart, the dealer told us not to worry about financing. "With your credit score you could buy the whole damned lot."

We're now getting all sorts of solicitations for savings/checking accounts "paying twice the average interest". Wow! You man you're going to pay 1%?

[invalid unparseable]

I have no problem with soldered copper or glued PVC. Threaded plastic compression connections (P-trap and similar) just don't like me :-(

[krw]

I should have been clearer. Repairs always go sideways. I can cut it all out and start over, at least in copper. I don't have enough experience with CPVC to know. It's the pressure side that always blows up, though I have had nine-rounders with toilet flange seals, too.

[Leon]

Certainly but this example is not even algebra, simply multiplication and division. BUT you may have a point, many people have problems with doing simple math in their "head". We know a couple and she is no dummy but if she did not have 10 fingers simple addition would be impossible for her.

Do you have proof of that? '~)

Yes there is that. Inherited wealth does not make one even smart. Watch how fast it disappears after acquisition. I have a couple of cousins that fall into that category.

And then there are those that you see every day on TV. Entertainers, actors, and professional sports figures. They are rich and as history points out most are not terribly smart. The majority are talented but not smart. The college scandal comes to mind and pro athletes that are broke a few years after retirement.

Leave credit out of this. ;~)

Yes and that is possible future value but not actual wealth, leveraging.

[Leon]

The banking industry has gotten pretty weird.

As an example we have had a credit card from a particular bank for many years. Our FICO for both of us is a couple of points under 800. We were going to buy a new home last year and our credit scores from the big 3 agencies averaged above 800.

We "cannot" open a savings account at the above mentioned bank with out a credit check. Never mind that they know what our credit is, we use their credit card all the time and pay it off every month.

[Leon]

AH! Good description that I have been looking for. I actually retired at 40. Did not plan it but I/we did fine. I continued to work for gravy spending. In fact we continued to make accelerated house payments for 2.5 years after I retired. But I still work, a little. LOL I bring in about what I did 40 years ago, no make that 45 years ago.

I have done my share of outside the wall plumbing. I have learned that a connection will leak if it is too loose or too tight. The lesson I learned is to leave a dry paper towel under the new connection for 24 hours.

[Leon]

9 rounders with toilet flange seals, LOL. It might have been cheaper to have called a plumber in on that one.. LOL

[Jack]

My brother also fit that bill. Never had a loan, never had a credit card. He was buying a computer from Gateway via mail many years ago, and he wanted a credit card to pay the $4000 bill. His bank gave him a hard time because he had no credit rating so they wanted to give him a small credit limit, not enough to pay for the computer. He told them in that case, he would pull is $50,000 cash account from their bank, an put it in another bank. They decided he was a good risk after all...

[hubops]

A few years after a relocation I learned that my bank started to charge a dormant account fee of $ 1. per month until my account went to zero - about $ 50. total - I complained and was offered 1/2 of the amount refunded - I asked for the Mgr. / Asst Mgr. and he was holding to that offer. When I told him that I hadn't received any mailings about this new fee

- he stated that the rule-change was posted at the branches - Duh ! .. the account is dormant ! I'm not visiting the branch ! I finally asked him to check his computer for my and my wife's retirement savings accounts and asked him if he really wanted to lose that business over the $ 25. ... .. his " I don't like to be threatened " answer was met with a calm reply - " It's not a threat, it's a promise. " I got my complete refund and closed the dormant account and soon after transferred all the retirement savings accounts also. John T.

[J. Clarke]

That's the way to lose customers. We have life insurance policies in force with face amounts under $10 that we've been carrying on the books for decades.

[Clare Snyder]

Twice over??? Not to mention the "expert" wouldn't have "fixed" it - he'd have sold you a new pump and likely as not installed it EXACTLY the way the failed one was installed - - - -

[krw]

How about major lottery (1M+) winners?

Ask Dave Ramsey about leveraging.