OT: If all cars were electric ...??

If all cars were electric instantly the grid would shut down and the economy would collapse

Reply to
FMurtz
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And your detailed reasoning is ... ?

Reply to
Andy Bennet

No need for anything like that with the grid imploding and it should be obvious what that would to the economy.

Reply to
Aaron

In article , Aaron scribeth thus

Well seeing that most all charging would be done overnight|?.

A large reliance of mothballed coal stations would i expect have to be bought online but TNP may have better views on them,!.,..

Reply to
tony sayer

Plenty would be charging at work and in the carparks.

We'd have gone to nukes by then.

Reply to
Aaron

You only need to look at te UK prodiuction of road fuel to see how much extra leccy we would need to replace it.

46 billion litres of fuel a year. Ok lets say that electric is 100% effiecent aand fuel 33% so that is ~15 billion 'effective' litres.

I litre is about 10kWh, so that's 150 billion Kwh or 150 million GWh or

150,000 TWh

going for a crude ~ 10,000 hours a year, thats a steady 15GW of power needed over and above what we have.

If tahts cioncetrated into the hours of darkness when no solar panels are operating its around 45GW.

We dont have that capacity... In fact we dont have any spare capacity at all for winter...

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

There is a higher margin than last year

7.1 GW (derated) 11.7% more than last winter

The total maximum technical capability from generation supply for this winter (excluding interconnectors but including wind and solar) has been forecast at 104.7 GW.

(both from page 14 of the winter outlook report)

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Total available generation across a very significant part of the year exceeds demand by more than 15GW

The derated margin is currently 14883MW for 1pm-130pm today and was around 25GW overnight

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Reply to
The Other Mike

Hahahahaha.

for 30 usecs on a stormy day in full midday sunshine

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

All meaningless. What matters is the cold overcast dayts with no wind and -15C.

When no sun and no wiund power is available

Bullshit to say they can cope.

You dont design for average, you design for worst case.

That statement you made is meaningless.

sure itr is. Its warm and its windy.

BUT we still cant cope with ALL electric cars and the stupidity of adding in intermittent renewables as if they were available all the time is yet to be seen for the utter folly that it is.

I bet the total fossil/hydro/nuclear capacity is about 55GW.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

and how much of the non-green capacity is actually online at any one time? Not all of it.

NT

Reply to
tabbypurr

Oh well, that's it then. We're screwed.

Reply to
Andy Bennet

Indeed, was taught at a young age that designing a door height to meet the average meant ~50% won't fit through it.

It won't be long before the greens start to turn against hydro:

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"But researchers say the building of dams in Europe and the US reached a peak in the 1960s and has been in decline since then, with more now being dismantled than installed. Hydropower only supplies approximately 6% of US electricity.

Dams are now being removed at a rate of more than one a week on both sides of the Atlantic.

The problem, say the authors of this new paper, is that governments were blindsided by the prospect of cheap electricity without taking into account the full environmental and social costs of these installations.

More than 90% of dams built since the 1930s were more expensive than anticipated. They have damaged river ecology, displaced millions of people and have contributed to climate change by releasing greenhouse gases from the decomposition of flooded lands and forests. "

Are governments really blindsided or were/are they merely doing the popular thing to get re-elected?

Reply to
AnthonyL

Generally they were making fair decisions & knew the cost of loss of land. Since then land value has gone up & energy value has come down. Flood failures have also not helped.

NT

Reply to
tabbypurr

The political temtpation is to add in all te intermittent renewables and the interconnects as potentially available capacity.

The reality is that in shit weather - cold and no wind acros NW Europe we EXPORT to Franmce to kep THEIR lights on, there is sod all solar even at midday, and no wind to speak of - maybve 1 GW from N of scotland.

So there is nothing we can *rely* upon except thermal plant and hydro. Its all very well for te grid to publish this reassuring nonsense, but the reality is we are very very close to serious shortage of capacity.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

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