Better to have a real smart meter or dumb smart meter?

[Andy Burns]

Yes, the suppliers are obliged to "push" you to have one, but you're not obliged to accept one

I suspect OFGEM will soon change it so you have to have one.

[Jeff Layman]

I believe that the utility companies have a legal obligation to offer you a new meter if yours is out of certification or calibration, but you do not have a legal obligation to accept it. I don't know if they can force a change, by using a warrant to gain entry into your property to complete the change in a similar way to change ordinary meters to prepayment ones.

The argument usually used by the utility company is that if the charge seems too much because the meter is reading too high, they won't entertain a refund because they offered you a newly certificated meter, which you refused. What they never say, of course, is that the reverse is also true, and that a meter could just as well be reading too low (in fact that's much more likely as the gears get old and perhaps sticky).

[Brian Gaff]

I can only confirm what you say. Although there are still refurbished older type meters about, EDF only fit the electronic kind as used by the smart meter part. I did initially have the new one fail after a year, right on Christmas day, leving me with no economy 7, but after that all has been well and it seems to be working so far. Others have said that theirs loses the connection to the system, and as this one supposes must either be over the mains cable or via a mobile connection, it could I imagine happen if your meter is in an underground spot. I like the fact that there is no more meter reading to be done and bills only get taken on real readings not the wildly inaccurate estimations EDF used before. Strange how those always ended up with them holding my money and not the other way around. I like the talking customer display and the way it changes tariff for economy 7. I have no gas here, so cannot comment on that. Brian

[Jeff Layman]

All of us are paying for it whether we have it or not.

Sadly, I agree with you! We are stuck into this extensive legislation forcing smart meters on everybody. Unfortunately, no government is going to say "enough is enough - we've got to stop throwing good money after bad". But that's not surprising as its *our* money, not theirs.

It might be possible to get an old meter; it just depends on whether or not any (re)certificated ones are available.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Its amazing what a few by-election defeats will do.

[Jeff Layman]

I doubt it will make much difference to what they could get with Economy

7 or whatever it is called. Apart from running washing machines or dishwashers at night there's not much of a saving to be made. Of course, it might temp you to change from gas heating to electricity. Not only is electricity much more expensive than gas (at present), but the cost during the day would be very high. And, as I mentioned at the start, how much difference would this make to currently using Economy 7 with storage heaters?

How much smart meters are going to "save" is reducing every time someone looks at the figures. It used to be hundreds of pounds for every consumer. Now, you might like to look at, for example,

. Quote:

"Smart Energy GB have calculated that, collectively, the savings could be as much as £560 million if everyone in Britain changed to a smart meter.

This savings figures was further broken down regionally as part of their summer campaign to promote the benefits of upgrading to a smart meter, with the following results:

Londoners could save up to £69.6 million a year if each household (583,083 homes) had a smart meter installed Scotland could save as much as £51.1 million a year if each household (544,719 homes) had a smart meter installed West Midlands households could save as much as £49.1 million a year if each household (585,694 homes) had a smart meter installed

The above numbers were calculated by Smart Energy GB based on a 2% average energy consumption saving per household per year, which equates to £21.17 when calculated in line with fuel prices published by the Energy Saving Trust in March 2018. This is then multiplied by the number of households per region, which was then rounded."

I can't get my head round the figures. The individual areas "could save" about £80 - 120 per household, but the last paragraph puts the saving at only £21?!

I don't disagree, but it just goes to show what incompetents we have when it comes to energy needs in this country, if the wrong solution is better than doing nothing.

[SteveW]

If I'm on holiday, I'm not checking my smart meter ... I might not even have my phone turned on.

[Rod Speed]

Hardly anyone is actually stupid enough to put their residential address on social media.

But the better systems will have notified the house occupier that the power has been off for days so they can get that fixed remotely so they don't come home to a stinking fridge and freezer full of rotting food and have to buy a new fridge/freezer.

[Rod Speed]

Don't believe that given the number of them needed.

You are ignoring the cost of a monkey showing up periodically to read your stupid meter.

You do pay for a monkey showing up periodically to read your stupid meter.

Bullshit.

[SteveW]

The trouble with deep standby is the start-up time, which puts many people off using it. I often put the TV on in the kitchen, while I am doing things and then, when I am finished, move into the living-room and carry on watching. Over a minute and often nearly two, missing from the programme, as I start the living-room box up is just too much.

[SteveW]

Many people with dumb electricity meters have electronic ones these days. They've been around so long that we were on our third before we switched to smart meters.

[Sam Plusnet]

Which is typical government bullshit. Instruct a body that they _must_ do something, but refuse to given them any authority get it done.

I am not suggesting that energy suppliers should have the power to compel their customers, but the gross dishonesty involved is galling.

[Sam Plusnet]

They disguised themselves with a flat cap, a striped jumper and a mask which only covered a narrow band around their eyes[1]. Once the general public caught on to this disguise, they had to seek new methods.

[1] I forgot the sack with the word "Swag" on it.

[Sam Plusnet]

I don't like or want smart meters, but I do accept that, once the 10 year calibration period expires, the meter is (effectively) no longer a meter.

However, I do feel very sorry for the poor sods who will eventually turn up to change our meters.

The electricity meter will be no problem (to fit, but getting a G2 signal is a very different matter).

The real problem is the gas meter. Ours is buried _inside_ a wall which is below ground level, and is actually part of the road's sub structure.

Do they get paid a set fee for each installation?

[Animal]

correct for electromechanical meters

there's no probably about it, they have been found to charge for it at upto 6x normal real power rate.

[Animal]

they don't.

incorrect. Why don't people get informed before making claims?

Yes, they're fire hazards and in most cases serve no real use.

[Animal]

It's not a claim, they do cut people off. For the crime of disagreeing with their dodgy bill, you're liable to get put on a much higher rate prepayment plan. That means you get cut off repeatedly.

A lot of their misbilling & misbehaviour is very hard to interpret as a mistake. They've made a fortune from it.

[Animal]

Savings have been talked about but have not materialised. Reminds me of nuclear electricity being 'too cheap to meter'.

not true at all.

those will never happen. Some might believe politicans' promises, but it's not doable at any cost.

the idea is inherently unworkable.

[Animal]

nothing

they have taken no for an answer in lots of cases

means nothing

more waste.

[Animal]

£560m is under £10 a person. In reality they don't save anything. They have no mechanism by which they could. Claimed savings are based on politician nonsense.