Ten times isn't close to right:
These are state averages.
My guess, pretty much in line with income.
Of course one should also figure in state income tax and sales tax.
Pretty meaningless chart. The town sets the rate, not the state. Take
CT for instance. In my small town in the NE corner, a decent house
can be had for $200,000. That same house on the same size lot will be
about $800,000 in Greenwich in the opposite corner. Yet they give a
single tax rate for the state. We have few millionaires, Greenwich
has a half dozen of every block.
Using that same $200k house, taxes in my town are $2400 a year, but
one town over, it would be about $3000.
I see New Hampshire has a very high rate. They have no sales tax
though so you save about 5% to 8% on the price of a $40,000 car. Not
I see high rates for other states, but what is the price of housing
there? Is a 2000 square foot house in Wyoming going to sell for the
same as the identical house in Ridgewood, NJ? How about Fortescue,
Tax rate means nothing without knowing how much the house is valued for
taxation. Some places assess it at FMV, others at a small fraction of that.
And, of course, FMV varies widely from place to place...FMV for something in
Hawaii is many times what it would be in, say, Iowa.
Around here (Cook County, IL) none of that means much. They just
manipulate whatever factor needed to get the money they want.
My house is worth about $200k on the market.
A few years ago it was $400k.
Taxes are a few hundred shy of $6k.
Every assessment (3 years) I pay a tax lawyer to protest my
The last time I talked to one of his staff and asked why my taxes went
up while my "market value" was halved.
He said, "They just adjust the rate to get what they want."
Since I'm on a fixed income now, taxes are a huge hit.
It's mostly "public" worker high pay, and rich pensions causing that
from what I see.
The only answer I see is to bite the bullet, or move.
Haven't decided yet.
You are exactly right. You are paying in property tax about twice
what I pay for what sounds like a slightly less expensive house. And
the deal with the politicians just setting the rate to get what they
want is what they do in most places to set the tax rate - While people
bit and moan over the fed income tax changing a couple percent they
don;t even pay attention when the local city councils, county boards,
and school districts raise tax RATES by double digits. My taxes on my
house went up 15% in one years time. My income sure as hell didn't.
Those are just the state tax rate and without knowing how they assess
value that data is useless. In AZ the Assessed value can be
considerably LOWER then the actual value. So what's the setup in NY,
is the tax applied to an arbitrary lower value, as in AZ or to the
actual price the home would sell for? Those number also do not
include all the special taxing districts, country tax, city tax,
school tax, bonds and on and on. You need to compare the actual TOTAL
property tax bill of a typical 2000 sf house in a typical NJ medium
sized city to the same 2000 sf house in another state to get the real
I'm in NJ.
Same deal, house is assessed for a lot less than market value.
I understand the possible limitations of that chart.
There are a lot of variables to consider.
There were a lot of sites with comparisons of state tax rates.
Feel free to reference others if that one doesn't suit your
On Fri, 16 Aug 2013 08:14:46 -0700 (PDT), firstname.lastname@example.org
The police and fire people work??? That's a laugh. They are the most
overpaid and under worked "labor class" in the country. A study some
years back showed that the vast majority of "on the job injuries" for
fireman were injuries they got at the fire house playing volleyball
and such between calls. Some of them spend half their PAID shift
sleeping. Cops spend a huge chunk of their time driving cars around
accomplishing nothing. And state troupers spend almost all their time
burning up gas harassing motorists. When we had a big budget crunch
in the past several years the highway patrol had to stop doing so much
wasteful driving - no one noticed the change in service. One of the
local PDs that had to reduce staff for the past several years studied
the result and could find zero evidence of any actual reduction in
service that resulted in anything, no change whatsoever in crime
rates, just an increase of a minute or so in responding to calls. The
police and fire in cities of any size are all unionized which means
all they care about is doing as little as possible for the most amount
of money and protection from being fired no matter how much they screw
I don't know which is more economical: providing affordable housing or
dealing with all the wonderful side effects of having thousands of
homeless people wandering the street...of course since all homeless must
by definition be liberals, at least they don't vote
So should food.
I'd have to posit that the problem with public education may well be a
symptom of bureaucracy, but my experience clearly shows that the vast
majority of parents increasingly take less and less interest and
involvement in their childrens education UNTIL one comes home with info
that the parents forgot to grace them with
My poor lil feelings are hurt that nobody followed up on my post (in earlier
car insurance thread which quickly became a classic example of thread
There were many personal anecdotes of experiences with the health care
system, military and civilian, but nobody really addressed the topic of
medical care which in the U.S. is commodified as an "industry" rather than a
"When I was living in Europe, a member of my family was treated, long-term,
for a very serious condition, without a penny of cost, even though neither
of us was a national of that country.
Allow me to reiterate that physicians in many developed countries -- I only
know specifically about European countries, so am extrapolationg -- complete
their medical studies at government expense.
No sky-high tuition bills from for-profit universities. No crushing debt
load for the first 15-20 years of practice. No wild divergence in
physician-hospital fees between practitioners and institutions. No drive to
specialize in big money practices like plastic surgery. In return,physician
obliged to devote 'n' years to (more or less) government assigned practice,
meaning often working in under-served communities.
Sounds like a win-win to me. In those countries, health care is not
considered an "industry" --I wince every time I hear that term --but a
Those governments must have figured out that $1 spent on preventive health
care and affordable care for existing conditions saves $100's of dollars
down the line in social costs that we pay out of our other tax pocket."
The usual comments on this kind of suggestion lean heavily to "...they have
to wait months/years for a procedure... whereas we in the US can get it fast
Yeah, sure, if you have insurance or can pay out of pocket. If not, you're
basically fracked. Leaves out a large segment of the population
The public seems to have a very hard time understanding that if we don't
emphasize preventive care*, and don't make medical care available to all, we
pay for it ANYWAY in the form of social costs for damage done to and/or by
impaired individuals who didn't get care in time.
*For just ONE example: In most "developed" countries, qualified
professionals follow new mothers and babies in their homes for a period
after the birth to make sure there are no complications. In the U.S., where
childbirth for a while was handled like a McDonald's drive-through until
outrage forced some retrenchment, there were many cases of babies having to
be rushed back to the hospital because of undiagnosed post-natal problems.
Enormous cost that could have been avoided by a much less expensive program
as described above.
(steps down from podium)
It's probably not possible to have any kind of rational discussion on the
subject right now although I know that the Chautauqua Institution (summer
camp for adults) has courageously chosen the subject for discussion all of
next week and they work hard to have useful "civil discussions" on their
topics. See: http://www.ciweb.org/education-lectures-week-nine/ There are
summaries of the topics in the daily newspaper (free) at:
http://chqdaily.com/download/ if you are interested in what was said. I'm
sure there are better ways to deliver health care to the U.S. population
with less cost and better quality than we have now; but, sadly, few seem to
know how to make that happen or want to get beyond the politics.
In theory, it is possible to have a rational discussion. However, that's
not likely to happen in the USA. I've found that liberals operate on
emotion,and conservatives operate on rational thinking. When a
conservative asks what has worked overseas, or asks if such a plan has
been tried before, he is met with overwhelming shouts of "starving
children" and "dead babies" from he left.
I hope the camp has some kind of rational discussion. However, if they
do, the politicians of the USA will drown them out with screams of dead
babies and starving children.
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
On 8/16/2013 8:15 AM, Tomsic wrote:
One of the "Occupy WTF" kids was asked what form of government he
supported and he replied that it was Communism. When he was told that
Communism was a failure and it had collapsed in most places it was
tried, his answer was "We can do it better." O_o
Agreed (if you're talking about hard-line "wingnuts" of any party - let not
SM seems to conveniently forget Republican transgressions when enumerating
the sins of people he clearly doesn't like. He forgets Boehner jumping on
the "save Terri Schiavo" bandwagon and invading that family's personal grief
so they could "save" a certified brain-dead woman from a liberal "murder
plot" - as emotional a basis of action as you can get.
The bottom line is that all political parties are composed of human beings
who do very human things. To claim one side is superior just isn't credible
and contributes to people forming poor opinions of SM.
I admire you for trying to illuminate SM's understanding of the world, Wes,
but I suspect you will get no farther than you might by throwing a potato
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