On Fri, 16 Aug 2013 16:44:44 -0400, "Robert Green"
Yep. Many people just don't want to face "the end" sooner than they
have to. Can't say I blame them, or know how I'll handle it.
My old dog died Sunday. She was about 17 years old.
Never been to the vet, and "healthy" until the end.
A little slower getting up the last year or so, and gone deaf.
Otherwise normal until about a half an hour before she died.
Then she just stood in one place.
But she didn't look worried. Looked normal standing there.
I knew I would have to take her to be put down in the morning.
I dreaded that. Because I would have to give the vet the nod.
"Kill my dog."
After about 10 minutes she slowly walked over to her hallway spot and
laid down with her head on her paws. Did a little gasping, then
rolled on her side, stretched out and whimpered for about 10 seconds.
Then she was gone, her head in my wife's lap.
She never looked more pretty.
She lived fine, and died fine.
Too bad all dogs and all people don't have the luck she did.
It would make things a lot simpler.
Dogs can be pretty noble creatures, and my family has been blessed in
that regard. My son recently had his 16 y/o schnauzer euthanized...his
boys were with them, Buster got special meals, and many long walks in
the woods up to the end. He had a bad back for a few years and could no
longer climb the special steps to get into bed with anyone :o) He
walked a lot, and could make a circuit through the kitchen to dining
room to living room to hall and would keep going round and
round....instinct to keep from stiffening up? He never spent a day on a
chain in the yard, was always walked for exercise and doing his jobs.
If he dared to beg at the dinner table, it was just by laying his head
on your knee....that was also his way of asking for some cuddling. When
Buster was obviously nearing the end of his life, he got an adopted
brother, six years old, to train by example. Another great little pet,
well trained and loved a lot.
)-: My condolences. We can learn a lot from the quiet dignity of animals.
Maybe that's why God gave them a lifespan so much shorter than ours. I just
said to my wife yesterday, this the more love than might ever expect for
$5.56 in Purina dog chow a week. You never realize how much a part of
everything they were until they are gone.
On my second date with my then-to-be wife we had to take her dog to the
emergency vet and then discovered he was very badly hurt and would not
survive (old spinal injury from a long-ago mauling by a much larger dog). I
think she was just a captain, still a long way from her retirement rank of
colonel, but watching her sit with her dog of 15 years as the euthanasia
drugs took effect made me realize that beneath that stern officer's demeanor
there was a person with a great capacity for love.
I don't think anything but a massive cultural shift will change the way we
approach death. Until we can extend life with quality and not zombification
we'll have some serious soul-searching to do as a nation.
Sorry for your loss, Vic. Post a picture somewhere so we can celebrate the
life of a good, good dog.
On Fri, 16 Aug 2013 22:36:35 -0400, "Robert Green"
Dogs don't mean much except to their owners.
It was just an example of what I thought was a full healthy life and a
My BIL's wake was the day before my dog died.
He was a real good guy, only 56. Always pretty healthy too.
Only guy I knew who did the type of brutal work I did forging hot
metal, except his was even more brutal, tonging big hammers.
He had my respect. Good husband to sis, good father, good
grandfather, good neighbor.
He was a better man than me.
Spent the last month of his life thrashing in a hospital bed, as
doctors butchered him trying to save him.
False hope after false hope, in a slow and continual downward spiral.
Late diagnosed aspergillosis.
Grieving our dog made us feel guilty, and I didn't even mention her
death to our extended family.
But grieve we did. In the end I'll grieve Dave much, much more.
RIP Dave. We miss you.
I'm sorry she is gone but glad she had a good life.
I think that in some ways it is harder to lose an animal friend than a human
one. I mean, the human knows that they will die, the animal does not; the
animal gives us unqualified love, can't always say the same for humans; the
animal is almost never cross or crabby, doesn't nag.
My sweet Lila died four years ago, she was only 13. I still miss her. I
miss the walks we used to take arounf\d our ten acres each morning although
the last few years neither of us were able to manage that.
Enjoy the memories of her time with you.
In the last few years, I've seen grown men cry when their dogs died or
had to be put down. Last year, the little critter belonging to my late
roommate adopted me before I could find a home for her. I was very ill
and when I woke up, I found Sandy, a Red Deer Head Chihuahua curled up
next to me under the blankets like a 4 legged hot water bottle keeping
me warm. I can't get rid of her now since she claimed me. I imagine I'd
be very upset if something happened to my little barking rat. I wasn't
looking for a dog, one found me. ^_^
I did stand-in mothering for my grandson last week when he had four
wisdom teeth pulled under general anes. He is a cell-phone devotee, and
his last words prior to procedure were, "I'm glad grandpa isn't here
taking my picture." 45 min. later, my precious zombie is trying to wake
up, ice pack wrapped around his head, and his eyes kind of rolling
around when he tries to open them. At the moment, I had custody of HIS
cell phone and decided there was nothing wrong with taking a picture of
his brief goofiness with HIS phone...snapped a couple of good pix, and
he reached over, took the phone, set the camera to "video" and told me
to take a video.....so I did an on camera interview while he was still
very groggy. Good stuff!
So, anyway, the point of this rambling is that I also dogsat for his
Schnauzer....little Fritz stayed in attendance with my grandson all day
while he slept off the anes./meds. Our Schnauzers have all been good
nurses and babysitters....they know if we are in bed during the day they
need to check often.
Be glad you don't have a cat....they like to jump onto your face when
I get along with both dogs and cats, I don't discriminate like some
folks who hate one or the other. Years ago a roommate's cat had a litter
and a little tom cat liked me for some reason even though I played with
all the kittens. The little guy would climb up my pants
leg, onto my shirt all the way up to my shoulder where he would curl up
into a little purring ball. Anyway all the kitten became very sick and
died including my little pal. It was upsetting because the roommate had
a bunch of cats that he didn't take care of like getting them the shots
they needed so it wasn't surprising when sickness would kill them. o_O
My current pets are perfect....9 adult koi, 5 baby koi, one giant
bullfrog and a few wandering leopard frogs. Bull frog stands guard in
the potted cattails until morning, then hops over to the shrubs for
siesta. Other critters visit occasionally but don't swim. I can leave
them all for a week without feeding during warmer months, just so's the
water circulates and aerates, and all winter with a heater to keep an
opening in the ice,. My kids bring their pets, cats and dogs, for
visits, and all are welcome. Grandpets are just like grandkids; nice
for a visit and then send them home :o) My daughter's Newfoundland
hasn't visited yet, and with the pond no longer all fenced in separate
from rest of yard, it would be highly interesting to see the blonde
bimbo go for a swim. She can reach kitchen counters without stretching
and regularly steals pizza/steak/burgers if one turns their back.
I raised a Weimaraner from a pup and the dog was so smart he was a
psychotic smart ass but he was a heck of a dog. I left one of those
little cans of Vienna sausage on the kitchen table then got up to answer
the door, when I came back, the can was in the same spot but
empty and the psycho dog was sitting there with an innocent look on his
face. Weimaraners have very expressive eyebrows and can convey all sorts
of mental states and emotions, it's hysterical. The goofy dog knew when
he was in trouble because I could tell by the face he made. ^_^
This is an extreme exaggeration.
There are indeed many entities that benefit from illness, and not all of
them are ethical.
And doctors have different levels of resistance to the unethical incentives.
But there ARE incentives developing that promise to improve wellness.
We in healthcare are actively trying to learn how to qualify for those
incentives. But even without them, it has LONG been the primary aim of
many non-profit healthcare providers to help people be healthy.
On Saturday, August 17, 2013 1:36:21 AM UTC-4, Wes Groleau wrote:
It's beyond extreme, it's just plain nuts.
Yeah, that's why all for profit healthcare providers refuse to
provide vaccinations for all those diseases like measles, polio,
tetanus, etc, right? Why they all don't tell fat people they need
to lose weight, instead they tell them to chow down on ice cream.
are drinking too much alcohol, they never warn them it's damaging
to their health and they should stop. They just want them all to get
sicker so they can treat them more. That's how it works, right?
On 8/17/2013 4:53 AM, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
If you worked in healthcare you might get it....here are a couple of
Patient #1, elderly lady, bad heart, doc prescribes drug to lower
cholesterol. Already takes heart and BP meds. Falls now and then, due
to bad heart. Starts having GI upsets and real bad shoulder pain.
Since she has a really bad heart, she has periodic spells of heart
failure, requiring diuretics. She is already on more meds than most
geriatrics can handle, so we put her in the hospital, stop all meds and
start over. Voila! Someone read the label on her cholesterol drug and
found out the GI upset and muscle pain was due to cholesterol drug. WTF
is a cholesterol drug going to do for an 88 year-old. It has long been
known that geriatrics are over-medicated and that they can't
tolerate/don't need same dosages as younger patients.
Patient #2, another elderly lady. Been on hormones and diuretic ever
since having hysterectomy in her 40's. Surgery x2 for bladder problems
related to hyst. didn't help the bladder problems. Put her on a drug
for stress incontinence. Put her in the hospital for diagnosis of chest
pain. Oh! Again, someone read the label on her incontinence med: "do
not prescribe for elderly patients".
If you haven't read about drug errors, hospital acquired infections,
wrong-site surgery, you've missed a lot. Simple hand washing would help
reduce deaths in hospitals but a lot of docs and nurses don't care.
My wife was on a bunch of meds too. Every once in a while, we sit
down with the doctor and review. After a couple of tries, she refuses
any cholesterol drugs too.
She recently had a major surgery and they changed meds again and
changed dosage on her heart med. Seemed ok for a couple of week, then
her heart rate increased considerably. She called the cardiologists
office and the nurse said to come in for the first available
appointment in about 10 days. That day, she went back to her old
dozed and thing went back to normal. When we saw the doc, I told him
she would have had an extra 800,000 heart beats tot he appointment
day. Pissed him off and they changed how they talk to patients now.
You have to take control of your care. You (or a close family
member) have to be your own advocate You have to review your
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