If the Sawstop turns out to be good, reliable technology, I suspect you will
see others try it in the future. My biggest concern is they are going to
get the Government involved and we will have another safety feature
legislated down our throats. From what I read, that is already in process.
On the other hand, it seems to be a pretty good safety feature. Most of us
think we are safe in the shop. I was telling my wife about my 30-year
safety record a few years ago - about a week before I went to the emergency
Absolutely correct! I made a stupid assumption that when you turn the
switch off the TS blade stops. Walked away, realized I had left a cutoff
sitting on the tabletop. Over-reached the blade and ^%#&$.
I kinda had the same situation. The saw had been turned off and I lost 1/2
my thumb. Accidents and lapse of judgment are can happen to anyone. I was
one of those silly people that thought that after 12 years of serious
woodworking that it could not happen to meeeee. Now after about 30 years I
realize more and more the possibilities.
And a guard would not have prevented my accident although I still do not use
one. Guards so not cover ever scenario.
You get better results by flicking the lever to "single shot" from
"automatic". Holds true when firing a machine gun. One shot on target,
as opposed to 30 misses.
What does that have to do with woodworking?
If every action is treated like THAT one will be the one that will hurt
you, then the utmost care in execution will be exercised. It's about
never letting your guard down. It is about eye-contact, when coming
close to a sawblade, or the asshole in the oncoming car who has his
blinker out but doesn't make the turn...eye-contact stops accidents. I
want to think about each movement. I do not want to become careless,
because some (SawStop)machine/guard is supposed to protect me. I want
to see the blade that can hurt me.
One accident that may have been prevented by the SawStop, will not
change the odds for an accident elsewhere in the shop. In fact, I think
that unit may build a false sense of safety which may be carried over
to the shaper (really should have a power feeder), drill press and
radial arm saw..or a jointer.. now there's nasty piece of gear. I DO
want a guard on that. (You don't sew a part-finger back on after a
jointer takes it off.)
Absolutely Freakin' Amen, Robbie!
That was exactly my point in the previous threads about this weiner
wacking wonder. (Did they test them on Nathan's Kosher All Beef?)
There is a damned fine book by David Pye called, The Nature And Art Of
Workmanship, that delineates craftsman made products as being made
under the rubric of The Workmanship Of Risk, and production made
products as being made under that of, The Workmanship Of Certainty.
Pye was actually talking about the methods used in the small shop v.
those used in production, and their result in the arena of design, but
he may as well have been talking about the level of risk in one shop
The only employee that I ever had get hurt did it on the jointer.
I'm personally scared to death by the shaper and use any contrivance
possible to keep my hands away from the cutterhead.
I can see SawStop being implemented through OSHA in production shops,
once the bugs have been ironed out.
Right now, you are asking a shop owner to carry replacement cartridges
for a unit that has not undergone adequate market testing, that costs
a substantial percentage of the original cost of the saw.
Take the airbag, please.
If you have an event that requires the deployment of the airbag(s),
the replacement cost is generally less than ten percent of the cost of
the vehicle. The level of false positives is less than 0.05%. This
is most often covered by insurance.
SawStop is more than double that, and market reports show that false
positives are in an unacceptable range. I am not aware of any
insurance program that covers the cost.
Maybe we should have freaking airbags on our saws that pop out of the
blade guard and knock our fingers away. It won't fry the saw and
you'll have a nice sack to store your oddments in.
tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet (real email)
You're confusing me, Tom. If you're saying that the cost of a replacement
cartridge and a sawblade are over 20% of the cost of the Sawstop, you're
wrong. Last time I looked, cartridges cost $60 and sawblades shouldn't be
over $140. That's $200 out of a saw/blade cost of $3600 or more. or roughly
5.5% or less.
If you're implying that the Sawstop costs over 20% of a comparable saw without
the safety features, that's open to interpretation. Because of the load the
safety feature puts on the saw, many of the components are much heavier duty
than on other saws. You can attribute that to the safety in which case
you're right, or you can say you're getting much more saw than others, in
which case you're wrong.
BTW, if the offer hasn't ended, Sawstop will send you a new cartridge for free
if you return the fired one -they're collecting data. That could end at any
time, of course.
It's turtles, all the way down
Oh yes, once that jointer gets through, your finger is going to be
thinly sliced and spread over a wide area. But what's next? Do they
start making JointerStop and DrillPressStop? Hey, why not go for
HammerStop so you don't hit your thumb?
I will e-mail you my address, so you can send me a new keyboard.
You just couldn't wait till I finished with my coffee, huh?
I am envisioning one of those boxing gloves on the end of an
articulated accordion style expandable arm, like the ones which punch
out cartoon characters. Install it at the shop door. Upon entering, it
will ask a series of questions. The second it detects attitude, it
punches you in the face and slams the door shut. IdiotStop... I think
you've got something there. *still laughing*
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