Re: Do you support educational vouchers in schools?

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There was essentially universal male education among Jews for the last 2500 years. It was private, with the community providing for those who could not afford it.
Also, competition was definitely allowed. Competition was restricted in other enterprises, as a grocer was not allowed to open shop too close to another, but teachers were excluded from this restriction. Also, it was recognized that ability differences needed to be accommodated.
--
This address is for information only. I do not claim that these views
are those of the Statistics Department or of Purdue University.
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Tell us you'll fight your own fires, and never drive on a paved public road, and we'll go away.
Deal?
Banty
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I can't answer for Dorothy.
My answer is "yes" -- I want to pay taxes to educate ALL of the children. And I'd prefer a system that provides for a decent education regardless of the local tax base, so some of my money may well go to areas that are far away from where I live.
My children are no longer in school (the youngest graduated almost a year ago) but I can't imagine my feelings about this will change. Many of the older adults I know are staunch supporters of public schools, and of using tax money to support them.
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care


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wrote:

I note that you snipped all the arguments and made an assertion that you can educate all of our children for that amount which I am quite sure you cannot do. You haven't the ability to individually contract any such thing. Note that all of us in society are responsible for this *not* a single person.
When *you* have taught children in the ghetto to read to the college level and to do algebra, geometry and other mathematics for several years, get back to me. And use your own money as you are so fond of not paying taxes.

-- Dorothy
There is no sound, no cry in all the world that can be heard unless someone listens ..
The Outer Limits
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toto wrote:

Dorothy, don't you realize that you're dealing with a dogmatic ideologue? And a common characteristic of dogmatic ideologues is the propensity for standing on their soapboxes and ranting, oblivious to any reasoned discussion. Such is the case with this ideologue, whose only response to substantive assertions is to demean in a condescending manner.
You can't reason with an ideologue, because by definition they refuse to be confused by the facts, which they either ignore or make up as they go along.
            Alan
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Yep. Nothing but assertions and presumptions (we're all "socialist", we all went to public schools, we're all brainwashed dummies, etc.etc.).

He doesn't know which facts he has and which he doesn't, obviously.
Oh but he's so much fun :-)
Banty
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Banty wrote:

A common tactic of the ignorant reactionary right is to stand on their soapbox and fling emotionally charged ad homenim attacks. The diversionary tactic of retreating to loaded emotional phrases in lieu of reasoned discourse has long been the retreat of the shallow of thought when having to deal with adverse opinion( especially when that opinion is backed up by evidence ). Especially when that opposing opinion is well written and indicative of good verbal and written skills( which the small-minded reactionaries of thought usually lack ).

The fun to be had with an ideologue is to goad them into ranting even more irrationally than they did initially.
            Alan
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It's a set of tactics not limited to "the reactionary right". I associate it with ideologues and extremists in general. Those on the left included.
Banty
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Banty wrote:

            Alan
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But you don't see yourself in this description?
Banty

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wrote:

Which is why I don't write for *him* at all, but for others who do understand how to reason and discuss things.
-- Dorothy
There is no sound, no cry in all the world that can be heard unless someone listens ..
The Outer Limits
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On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 13:01:43 -0500, Duane Bozarth

I didn't start the x-posts, but I generally do not cut ngs out unless I know that no one is answering from a particular group.
Why don't you stop net-copping? Or at least netcop the original poster not those who followup a discussion they want to have.
At any rate, I won't be answering him further probably.
-- Dorothy
There is no sound, no cry in all the world that can be heard unless someone listens ..
The Outer Limits
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Translation: Since I can't make a decent argument for my case, and have convinced no one, I will declare myself the winner and call everyone else names.
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care


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I know enough.

It's about parental control-freaks, as often as not.
lojbab
--
lojbab snipped-for-privacy@lojban.org
Bob LeChevalier, Founder, The Logical Language Group
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I don't watch "TEEVEE".
lojbab
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lojbab snipped-for-privacy@lojban.org
Bob LeChevalier, Founder, The Logical Language Group
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You are, indeed, playing stupid games.
See, I also want YOU to pay your fair share of taxes to educate all of hte children.
But you knew that.
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care


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wrote:

I don't know what the fascination is with *graduating early.* It's no guarantee that a student won't burn out. OTOH, some kids at ETHS did graduate early. Many of those went on to the top universities and graduated from those universities in 3 to 4 years too.

Not if your own thinking is any indication of what you taught him. You don't seem to understand logic or how to refute arguments in discussions at all.

In engineering or liberal arts? Just curious. My ds completed a chemical engineering degree with a double major (computers) and a minor in economics in 4 years. Most engineering majors take 5 years because of the number of courses they have to take.

And your son was in daycare during the day?

I think you are missing some of the costs of his education. The classroom space you used is already part of your home, but would need to be taken into account if you are going to compare costs for schooling.
Also, you need to account for your time (or your wife's time) at some salary here.

Cool. Please tell us the titles of your books and the publishers. (or were they self-published?)
I think you are making money off homeschooling parents with your subscriptions on your websites too. Please let us know how poor folks with no computer or internet access would be able to use your materials. (Many of my students didn't have a phone, much less a computer)
-- Dorothy
There is no sound, no cry in all the world that can be heard unless someone listens ..
The Outer Limits
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wrote:

It's not a matter of burning out on *learning* necessarily, but of burning out on pushing oneself to graduate or to get a degree or whatever else the ultimate *goal* is.
Example here. My dd has a friend who was a computer nerd early. He was programming for HP as a freshman in HS. He played chess, did all the AP math and science he could get, went to Northwestern for math courses after finishing his two AP calculus courses by sophomore year. Where is he now? Well, he quit college after changing majors 4 times, I believe. He runs a computer lab at a school, but his major interest is in philosophy.
Then there are several other *early graduators* who have dropped out of the *rat race* entirely and are living life working minimum wage jobs because they prefer not to be stressed out in terms of their work. They still learn things, but they do it on their own time and without any interest in getting a degree out of it or making money off it.
I just don't think that graduating early is a good goal. Sure, if you want to move ahead do so. Most kids though are not at the same level in all facets of learning so they may be better off going ahead in only a few subjects of interest and staying with their age group in other subjects. Or they may be better off entirely simply being kids rather than rushing into adulthood.
It's very individual.
-- Dorothy
There is no sound, no cry in all the world that can be heard unless someone listens ..
The Outer Limits
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Don wrote:

One you abandoned early on. Steve
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Don wrote:

Burning out on learning and burning out on school are different things. And it's easy to burn out on school.
--
--John
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