one bit of kit I don't yet have
what would the team recommend
brand price etc
Would be for occasional not daily use
site environment until we get the workshop finished then work bench mounted
What are the advantages/disadvantages of a sliding saw over a non sliding one?
already have a saw table and a hand held circular saw and a decent band saw
Regards
Sorry if it's obvious, but make sure it will cut the size of timber you're likely to want it to. The one I've ended up with will slide cut a 12" wide shelf. And can chop quite large stuff. The smaller ones can't. But this may not matter to you since you have other alternatives. My only alternative is a hand held circular saw.
Not much use bench mounted unless you have at least 2 metres clear each side (ie a very long bench). Better to get one of these:
YGWYPF. I started with an Axminster, then a Wickes, now a GMC. Would have saved money overall if I'd bought a Makita in the first place.
Until you have one :-)
Sliding saws with smaller blades give a good compromise for site use.
A non sliding saw has a limited width of cut. The only way to increase it is to use a bigger diameter blade.
A sliding saw has a bigger width of cut at a given blade size.
A sliding saw + a bigger blade gives a much bigger width of cut.
What do you want to spend?
Makita do a very nice 7" one at a reasonable price:
One of the proper stands with the telescopic side supports allow them to make a very nice easy job of cutting studwork etc.
This is similar to the Makita steel one they don't seem to do any more:
Advantages: wider cut capacity for a given saw blade diameter, and the ability to make trench (i.e. flat bottomed non through cuts).
Disadvantages: more expensive, heavier, less accuracy and more slop unless you buy a decent one. (many cheap ones start out fairly "tight" but get sloppy with use.
Some general background here:
So mostly studs and joists?
If it's lots of long timbers, rather than 1 metre or less bits of joinery, - then buy the best stand you can - they make an enormous difference to your productiveness.
This kind of thing:
I bought one of these - albeit at a lower price - for occasional use, and was agreeably surprised at the build quality.
I have screwed mine to a piece of worktop with a batten on the underside, so that it can be clamped in a workmate, like this:
Not buying one unless you need it.
Aldi. It's the only sliding one for under =A350. Anything else similar might not be Makita price, but it's probably =A3150+.
Chop saws like this have one main use: constructional carpentry in
2x4s. They're no use for joinery (real bench joinery, with joint cutting). They're very quick to use though, and they are great for butt and halved lap joints held together by screws. I don't do much "woodwork" on mine, but I do a lot of "building" work with it.A non-slider will chop 2x4s (and larger) either square or at angles. A slider will do two things in addition - firstly it will chop wider boards, such as skirtings. It's not "better", it just does things a non-slider can't even try to. Secondly it should have a depth stop, so that you can also cut halved joints with it - a purely hinged chopper can't generate the straight line needed.
A top-slider is nicer to use than a bottom slider, but tends to be bulkier to store and these machines are also the more expensive ones. A single bar slider works fine, but probably wears loose more quiickly than an expensive two bar.
You can use them on a commercial stand or on the floor. Bench mounting isn't much use, as they need space either side. I knew a workshop in Bristol that had three set up on a long bench, each permenantly set to a different angle - a very quick way to work if you're building garden furniture all day and you have the space. Mine is on an American-designed DIY portable saw bench (plans on the web somewhere)
- a rolling plywood cabinet with a gap in the middle. Tool boards for chop saws (and bobbin sanders, thicknessers, routers etc.) can be placed into this gap. If you have space and a couple of sheets of plywood, it's a handy thing.
These are horribly dangerous machines. They have the worst safety record for serious hand injuries or amputations in construction. Be careful using it, don't let your second hand on the bed of the machine when it's powered up - either hold a long piece of timber at a distance away (if your hand isn't touching anything closer than a hand span, it can't reach the blade) or else short pieces need a mechanical clamp or push stick.
That's an excessively alarmist POV. I've read by far the greatest culprit in tool-related serious injuries (rather than fall related injuries) in UK construction is nailers such as Paslodes.
In terms of woodworking machinery, table saws are worse (push job and hand simultaneously into the blade, working without a crown guard, or kickbacks), or radial arm saws. or worst of all spindle moulders (although they are uncommon outside of professional woodworking environments, and modern safety features have reduced accidents and severity of injuries).
With a mitre saw, you pretty much have to deliberately push the blade forward into your hand (or most likely your extended left thumb). I've seen mitre saws with the blade guard wedged back or removed - much the same a removing crown guards - sooner or later you will brush a rotating blade with flesh. But used as they are meant to be used, on a secure stand, with securely supported work, with blade guard working properly - the risk is small, controlled and predictable.
I've had my sliding saw for several years. Treat it with respect, but can't see it being anything like as dangerous as say an angle grinder. Or, as you say, a more normal bench saw.
Talk to the HSE - it's their hitlist. Some tool has to be the worst, this is the one.
Yes, but they don't create such serious injuries or amputations.
The problem is that classic left thumb amputation. If you're in the habit of clamping with your left hand near the blade, the risk is that one time you're too close.
I agree that it is very easy to go wrong with such a saw.
I've spent sometime conditioning myself with a reflex like habit of looking at my left hand placement before engaging power and as you say, being a handwidth's away from the blade...
The other thing that can happen is "snatch" if you (foolishly, due to inexperience) try to cut a piece too small and it gets thrown. That's bloody scary, especially as by the time it registers, the piece is in the process of bouncing off the wall the other side of the room.
But for some reason, large angle grinders actually impart more fear in me.
Mine has a pretty decent clamp. Pieces too short for that to work I'd cut by hand. Small off cuts can get thrown around occasionally. But they're not going to do you much damage.
Also, again on mine, it's pretty obvious where the blade goes by the slot in the bed. Keep your hand clear of that and you should be ok. Common sense really.
Absolutely.
Much as I am equally wary in using my 9" AG, I suppose they could be seen as safer in the sense that you just cannot use one without a damn good grasp of the thing in both hands.
Conversely, how many times has one tried using a 4"/4.5" AG with only one hand (something I almost never do, but the temptation is there)?
I did that. Once. Still have the scar.
Don't even think about it.
_Most_ of my angle grinder use is one-handed. Depends on the type of disk though.
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