Wooden French Windows & FENSA

[Christian McArdle]

You have misread the OP. There were doors there originally. They have been removed. It is my understanding that you may be able to replace them like for like.

Christian.

[Brian Sharrock]

Hmm ... it's an external door ...

An external window or door is a 'controlled fitting' under the Building Regulations, and so certain standards need to be met when an external window or door is replaced.

Is the door there? Yes/No?

Is the door 'external' [within the meaning of the Act]? Yes/No?

Would you like to re-consider?

[manatbandq]

messagenews:452d1b9e$0$577$ [e-mail]...

Read it again. Quote from the OP "I had a conservatory built in 1998 and had existing wooden french windows between the house and the conservatory".

All the OP needs to do is tell a little white lie and claim that he's put the original french windows back as they were. Assuming the Conservatory met all the relevant regs when it was built (with the french windows in place) then it still does. Changes are not retrospective. Taking the doors off for your own convenience/enjoyment for 4 years does not alter anything. He may have taken them down to repair them and just not got around to it until now ;-)

If the original situation didn't meet the regs then that's a different matter.

MBQ

[Guy King]

The message from "Brian Sharrock" contains these words:

Nope. I'm buggered if I'm contacting BC just to replace my back door.

[Dave Liquorice]

Is the door being replaced or repaired?

ISTR that the OP said that when he took the door down the frame remained in place. Thus the "door" has been "repaired" not "replaced". As has been pointed out the current regulations don't apply retrospectivly. The only gotcha I can see is if the *orginal* installation broke some rules.

Would you?

[archie2000]

Yes, I did have external french window style doors in place originall when the conservatory was built. I removed them 2 years later but lef the frame in place as I intended to put them back in the winter. However, we never bothered putting them back and a friend purchase them for his house.

All I needed to do was replace like for like but because they had glas panels I was told that they had to be FENSA compliant as they were ne doors. If I still had the original doors it wouldn't have been problem as they pre-dated the FENSA requirement and I could quit legitimately put them back.

The problem with the new doors was that the glass, although toughene safety glass did not meet the FENSA standard for energy saving and if had got the BCO involved they would have said as much and told me t change them. I could have had wooden french windows made with doubl glazed panels to comply, but time and finances were against this optio as we need to complete by next week or I may lose the house I a buying.

Archi

-- archie2000

[Brian Sharrock]

You haven't answered the questions posed; - is there a door and is the door external.

Can you _prove_ that the original doors are extant, perhaps propped up behind the sofa, or have they disappeared? If this was truly a 'frames remained in place' situation and there's frames with hinge cut-outs, an external door step, door jambs, etc. etc. then IMHO there wouldn't have been a problem. As the OP didn't/couldn't 'repair' the doors then s/he seems - in his/hers words- needed a 'FENSA' certified 'replacement'.

Any: who cares what the OP did/did not get up to living in this house with a 'conservatory' and no external quality door between the glazed area and his house? Surely the point about this newsgroup is about learning how ot 'Do-it-Yourself-_properly_' and not how to botch around the regulations?

[Owain]

Might he sell them back to you? :-)

Owain

[Dave Liquorice]

OK so perhaps for the pedants my question "Is the door being replaced or repaired?" should have come before the other two. AIUI repair does not come under BCO or FENSA.

Perzackerly.

It's only the buyers solicitor that is wanting a silly bit of paper, on being told the the doors in question are "new". This solicitor needs the regulations explaining to him. Being of the legal profession I doubt he would have any trouble what so ever understanding the requirement to examine the minutae carefully to come to the right conclusion. B-)

IMHO the point of the group is the free and frank exchnage of ideas. And highlighting how daft and ill thought through some of the more recent regulations are. This is not a botch around the regulations as the new regulations, IMHO, don't apply as it is a repair. So what that they have been off for a few years being repaired, there are jobs here I started a few years back, still to be finished. They will be, one day.

[Dave Liquorice]

Is this because the person you talked to interpreted "new doors" to mean frames the lot? Such an interprtation would mean FENSA/BCO etc.

But you kept the old ones in the garage and the roof leaked and they rotted a bit and when you oveshot reversing in one night you cracked both across the middle... SO you had to get "new doors" but they are repairs not replacements. B-)

[archie2000]

Guys

Can we put it to bed now please.

I am having FENSA approved doors fitted by a registered company so tha it complies with not only the purchasers solicitors requests but als with Building Regs. Without them and the FENSA certificate I canno sell the house.

I quote from the National Replacement Windows Advisory Service we site; "This certificate is vitally important to any future sale of th property, as without it, sales will be at least held up or at wors unable to proceed. At the point of pre-sale contract, purchaser Solicitors will have to include this documentation in their usua search procedures."

Thanks once again for all replies, both constructive and opinionated.

Cheers Archi

-- archie2000

[Matt]

"National Replacement Windows Advisory Service"?

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

Obviously a perfect place to go for an unbiased view, you just wasted a few more of the earths resources just to get a bleeding bit of paper that means f*ck all.

Of course, without the dumbass solicitor predicting doom and the end of life as we know it because of a missing fensa certificate things could be different.

The buyer might have half a clue and tell his solicitor to piss off arsing around and tell him to proceed as he couldn't give a flying f*ck what bleeding windows it has or hasn't got.

The buyer might have the common sense to not insist the vendor gets some stupid liability insurance that has so many exclusion clauses it resembles the england manager excuses list crossed with the Tokyo phone book.

Anyway if the buyer complains this far down the line the vendor just might leave a 2ft turd on the hot water tank and a dozen ripe kippers under the floorboards.

The buyer almost certainly won't like the windows you bought and will rip them off and chuck them into a skip the first week they move in.

Hope you can sleep at night you planet destroyer.