OT(ish) - toilet pan design

I don't think there is anyone squeamish on here, but if you are look away now. :-) . . . . . This concerns the design of toilet pans.
Our RAK toilets have a broad pan, a narrow throat with vertical sides, and a flat bottom (insert joke of choice here).
This design seems to encourage skid marks and the use of the toilet brush.
On my occasional travels I note that most other toilets have a wider throat with more of a slope and no flat bottom and these don't seem to collect the skid marks in the same way, and tend to flush clean.
Just wondering if there is an issue with the toilet design we have, and if most toilets don't have this problem.
Cheers
Dave R
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On 01/01/2018 21:06, David wrote:

I have a RAK designed toilet and I wouldn't get the same design again. A broad squared off pan at the front with a near horizontal surface with a throat at the back with very steep sides. What tends to happen is the shit gets deposited in the horizontal bit of the pan (for inspection) and then flushed down to the throat afterwards. Not too bad with a firm poo but diarrhea tends to stick like shit and requires the brush to tidy up the remains. The skid marks are at the front of the pan rather than in the throat. The only advantage seems to be that a flush always disposes of all the paper when too much has been used - unlike the pan it replaced which was a more traditional design.

Yes it's the design.
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Sounds like a German sort of design. I have heard it said that they find examining their stools useful. Or at least gratifying.
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Roger Hayter

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On Mon, 01 Jan 2018 22:09:09 +0000, Roger Hayter wrote:

With that type of toilet pan, all you need to do to eliminate skid marks is to place a single (or maybe a doubled) sheet of bog roll down in the shallow puddle for your poop to land on. This neatly prevents the shit hitting the pan, allowing it glide away on the flush without leaving a skid mark.
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It was pretty standard in Poland back in the '60s and '70s when I was there training (as in being trained).
My take at the time was that it was cheaper/efficient to make all loo pans the same (communist country then) and the 'flat' area was needed for hospitals and such for poo examination. I was probably completely wrong! :-)
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Before I retired, I used to work for a company that supplied raw materials to the ceramic industries of the UK and Europe, including sanitaryware, and would occasionally visit continental sanitaryware factories either to introduce new materials to them or assist in sorting manufacturing problems. The flat shelf in toilets was pretty common in Germany in the 1970's and 80's and presumably long before that. It wasn't particularly a 'communist' thing, and our local agent in Germany told me it was so that people could examine their stools.
Maybe in the pre- and post-war eras, diets in Europe weren't as good as today due to food shortages and people having to eat what they could get, and perhaps people got 'worms' more often, but today I don't think those flat shelf toilets are commonly made, but I'm not close to the industry any more.
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On 02/01/2018 10:28, Chris Hogg wrote:

Was the shelf under the water? Otherwise it would stink until you flushed.
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Not on the Polish ones, there was a sort of 1/2" deep puddle on the shelf if I remember (it was a fair old time ago!).
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wrote:

No, above the water, and yes, you sat in your own fumes until you flushed it away. Image here http://bit.ly/2CCYFIf I suppose you could s(h)it on it facing the wall if you were squeamish about these things and your aim was good, but the normal mode of use was to drop your jobbie onto the shelf.
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As was tried by at least one school mate circa 1968 in a Swiss Hostel for school trips, the rest of us got to know about it because his poor aim and a big arse meant he missed the pan completely.
G.Harman
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certainly fitted in the hotel I was staying at in Hamburg in the late '70s.
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from KT24 in Surrey, England

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On Mon, 01 Jan 2018 22:09:09 +0000, Roger Hayter wrote:

In my case it isn't a flat surface to crap on; I have seen these mainly in the USA with a "wash across" rather than a "wash down". Although my Granny did have an outside toilet of this design, probably pre-1900, which was a work of art.
I seem to be able to crap down into the water, just not always flush the results completely.
I don't think it is a stool consistency issue as such because my observations are based on me crapping in various toilets around the country. Some flush clean. some don't.
Then again I may have a non-standard arse. :-)
Cheers
Dave R
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Toilet designs changed around the time that water metering and volume-related water charging came in, and low-volume flush toilets became popular. Throats got narrower. In order to shift a jobbie from the bottom of the water trap and push it round the bend and into the waste pipe, you need a certain velocity of water. If you're going to reduce the volume of water, then you need to restrict the cross-sectional area of the pipe it flows through in order to maintain that velocity, i.e. you need to narrow the throat. With a narrow throat, the jobbies will be forced closer together, and will rub harder on the walls of the trap, resulting in more skid marks.
The other thing that effects it is the texture of the jobbie, which in turn is a reflection of the diet of the jobber. Soft squidgy jobbies are more likely to leave skids than rock-hard marbles, although brown soup probably won't leave marks. There is a scale of jobbie textures, known as the Bristol stool scale: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bristol_stool_scale
Enjoy your breakfast!
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Chris

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On Tue, 02 Jan 2018 08:32:41 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:

Perhaps this for breakfast?
http://sobadass.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/20130828-005041.jpg
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hope!). I imagine it was made by the nursing staff in the colo-rectal department of a hospital, possibly for the benefit of the senior proctologist!
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Chris

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I would think it was rather crude Photoshopping (other image manipulation programs are available) of the Bristol Stool Chart, which is freely available online.
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Roger Hayter

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On Tue, 2 Jan 2018 14:06:16 +0000, snipped-for-privacy@hayter.org (Roger Hayter) wrote:

I googled to see if I could find where it originally came from, unsuccessfully. It's surprising how many 'cake' versions of the chart are out there, including one that said 'happy birthday daddy'. http://bit.ly/2lHphjw
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Chris

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On 02/01/2018 08:32, Chris Hogg wrote:

I remember in the seventies (when hardly anyone had a water meter) we were urged to stick a brick in the cistern to conserve water, and some people objected, "Bricks in the cistern, bugs in the pan." Then they redesigned the toilet so it used less water and we were asked to put a plastic hippopotamus in the cistern.
Why don't people just trust WC designers to know how much water is required?
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Max Demian

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the water is needed to flush the waste into the main sewer. A smaller quantity if probably fine in urban areas where there are short sewer runs, but when your house is 100m from the road, as our previous one was, you need the greater quantity of water.
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Been in current house since 1988 and we do not even own a toilet brush - they seem digusting things. In the event of a mark then a driblle of Domestos soon makes it go,
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