OT: Happy 'World Milk Day'. (Not if you are a dairy cow of course).

And so the cycle begins again.

Get help, you need it.

....or a woman (not trans)

love creamy wonk

Quite!

It's actually quite sad how so many are completely ignorant of what has to go on for us to be able to take the milk away from the young of a different species, even thinking us 'milking cows' (/goats etc) is something that has to be done 'anyway' and so we are doing them a favour!

And this is news is it? Of course we know but while the world likes veal etc it will go on. In fact if we wanted to we could use artificial hormones to make Cows express milk, but i myself do not eat Veal, the French do though. Brian

Tim

I've got a great idea. I'll carry on eating meat and drinking milk because I put humans' needs/desires before animals'. You carry on not doing so, for very valid ethical reasons (even if I disagree with them).

And let's neither of us try to foist our opinions on the other.

I think Timmy also needs to talk to a few leopards, etc, if he wants the young of all species preserved.

Animals using another species for their own selfish needs is rife in nature.

Nice tasty lunch for the local foxhounds though.

We might arguably not be doing "cows" as some sort of species-group any favours, but the individual dairy-herd cows - yes, we are doing them a favour by milking them. As I understand it, they have been bred to produce so much milk that *not* milking them regularly would have significant negative consequences.

#Paul

Brian Gaff (Sofa) formulated on Tuesday :

French, Germans and Italians for certain, probably the Spanish too.

So what's the difference between you and a racist? You think it's ok to murder someone because they're a different species?

Just because someone else does something bad doesn't mean you should too.

They're then eaten by meat-eaters. You have to kill if you want meat, so we might aswell get milk from them first.

If they are a different species, its not murder

I have just added veal to my shopping list.

Why are there so many "duplicate" threads from this (plonked) wanacker?

Quite, given they wouldn't actually exist in such a mutated state if it weren't for out intrusion. Why would they?

Only because we artificially inseminate them then take their calves away and kill them?

Quite, Darwin would have a plan for them (in nature) wouldn't he?

You are admitting the only way they could survive is by our continuing to exploit them (so we should)?

Cheers, T i m

To many, of course.

Not with the right education. Many people have done many things considered 'acceptable' then that are no longer acceptable today and especially re the treatment of animals.

And reap the benefits in further worsening help issues.

I never have either, nor 'escargot'.

Not everone who is French doesn't, especially all the French vegans.

Cheers, T i m

The chances are it won't be but carry on. ;-)

I know you do. It would be interesting to know if you would still do that if you had to cut the throat of the animals yourself.

I will, thanks.

Ironically you are already 'foisting' your views on innocent creatures so there is no parallel or comparison.

Se, I'm not a vegan for me, I'm a vegan for all the animals that don't deserve to suffer and die and for the world that is being destroyed, just because the likes of you simply 'like' the taste of meat because of your conditioning. If you could be conditioned to do something, surely the most logical thing would be further conditioned not to do that thing, especially when the lives of innocent / sentient creatures are involved?

What does dog taste like, or cat, or do you draw the line somewhere?

And I'm guessing you DGAF about other humans either, all the antibiotic resistance from the livestock we consume. Or the habitat destruction threatening the remaining wildlife? Or those humans starving because of the inefficient way we use resources? Or the pollution we humans are suffering from all the livestock waste ...?

"Carnistic Defenses

Carnism runs counter to core human values, such as compassion and justice. Most people wouldn?t willingly violate these values and support unnecessary violence toward other sentient beings. Therefore, carnism?like other oppressive systems, such as patriarchy and racism?uses a set of psychological defense mechanisms that distort our thoughts and block our natural empathy, so that we act against our values without fully realizing what we?re doing. In other words, carnism conditions us not to think and feel.

Carnistic defenses hide the contradictions between our values and behaviors, so that we unknowingly make exceptions to what we would normally consider unethical. "