If that is a re-badged DeWalt, would it not make sense to get an 18V DeWalt ID "body only"?
Having said that there seems to be only limited choice of dewalt/fatmax body only tools... e.g:
which is a bit more pricey since its the brushless version.
Yes / no. It may be that for the cost of the body only I could get a complete stand-alone solution that would be more than adequate for my needs, given that it may not be as versatile as my existing (hammer) drill driver ... or, it wouldn't be the best example of the genre for a given price.
Also, the advantage to *me* of a ID over my existing (and so far, perfectly adequate) DD, could be less than that for those who sound like they might have 'weak' DD's?
Sure.
The 'hype' here from some re ID's makes me want to give one a go (I particularly respect your POV because I know you do your research, do lots of nice work and have a wide range of tools, including (probably) 'good' DD's) but I keep harking back to the diy wiki that seems to share my questions / reservations on ID's over DD's for 'most' applications?
How much would I want to spend if my existing DD does (guess) 90% of what any single tool could do (for *me*) and how much work of the type where an ID might be 'better' do I do and so at what cost.
I'm not suggesting you are trying to pressure or convince me to get an ID of course , I'm just thinking out loud why / how / when an ID could be 'worth it' to me? (Considering I rarely even need an excuse to buy more tools). ;-)
Cheers, T i m
If I were only allowed one rotational cordless tool, then I would go for the 18V combi drill, since its the most versatile and will replace a mains drill in most situations. I use mine for drilling - even with hole saws and big augers, mixing plaster / small quantities of mortar etc and various other jobs. It will also drive screws just fine. Armed with some Bosch multimaterial bits it will even make a credible job on hard masonry, when you don't want to get the SDS out.
If I were adding a ID at that point, then I am torn between the 18V and the much smaller lighter 10.8V, but I would probably for for the 18V ID as it is fast and powerful - it will hurl screws into joists, and studwork very quickly and easily, and can also be fairly fine and controlled if required. For building work I would not want to be without it. However keep in mind I do a reasonable amount of what one might class as building rather than more traditional DIY.
The smaller lighter one however is nice for smaller trim type work, and furniture making - while I could cope without it (and indeed did for years), its a "nice to have". (and in reality is has a much driving torque as my big combi).
This is the 10.8V set I got (note there is another version about that looks similar but only has a DD rather than a combi - so read the spec carefully). This is the bag I would grab for many "fixing" applications.
Probably worth keeping in mind that much of that wiki article was written some time back when IDs were way more expensive and there was much less in the way of choice. Also some of the content was directed at the frequent discussions going on here at the time suggesting that IDs were good general replacement for a drill, or an angle drill, or just confusing them with the mechanic's tool of the same name.
Might be time to tweak it a bit.
Much will come down to how much work you do with it, and also what type you do. Not to mention how comfortable you are with powered screw driving in general - some of it takes practice to develop technique to do it easily.
Nope not trying to pressure, more a suggestion that it would be worth having a play with one and getting a feel for it. You may be pleasantly surprised...
Some years back I did that with the one you see in the wiki - which at the time cost me about £70 "body only" IIRC (where buying a full kit would have been more like £300). I figured I could always stick it on ebay if it did not work out. I have since acquired more of them on the grounds that I found it more than good enough to warrant it.
I think there are three tools where I have had that kind of "wow, that is so much better" moment... using a quality jigsaw after the DIY spec ones, using a SDS drill after a normal "hammer" drill, and using an impact driver after doing lots of powered driving with the combi drill.
(and keep in mind I built a whole loft conversion with that combi and was not in any way dissatisfied with it - I rate it as an outstandingly good tool)
There are lots of cheap used IDs on eBay at the moment. I bought one a while back and have been impressed.
Ok, so we agree on that then. ;-)
And for me, that *if* is the $1000 question (and why I posted it etc). ;-)
Sure, so it's a 'powerful' tool and hence more (traditionally) suited to bigger / heavier jobs.
Ok.
Makes sense. Same with my Bosch electric screwdriver where if I was doing enough of the right sort of job (that it suited) then I'd be bothered to get it and put it on charge (I don't actually know where it is any more). ;-(
Ouch, I've paid less for a car. ;-)
Ah.
Ok.
I think it might. ;-)
Sure.
I think that (intuitively in use or lack thereof) reflects the suitability of a tool to a job. Like, I didn't really have to learn how to use my FatMax DD for anything I've used it for so far. Some of that may be down to me using most of the dedicated tools beforehand (mains powered single speed drills or electric screwdrivers) and therefore had an expectation (hope). Luckily the FatMax DD has met those (so far anyway).
Agreed wholeheartedly.
Happy to be, like I said, I don't generally need an excuse ... ;-)
Noted.
+1I sort of get that but only for a very small subset of what I typically need to do.
Watch this space ... ;-)
Noted.
Thanks for the feedback. I think this is going to be very much a 'proof is in the eating' scenarios.
Cheers, T i m
I don't generally buy second hand tools. 1) because there would be no guarantee and 2) they could easily be stolen.
I would need to try before buying with something like this.
Cheers, T i m
ITHM there are lots of *new* cheap IDs on ebay...
Sure, but as you suggest and I agree, I really think it's something I would need to try before I buy.
eg, How many people here advocating the use of ID's have Tinnitus where the chances are that even a short exposure to one in use close up (without hearing protection that I wouldn't need with a DD) may raise my Tinnitus levels for a few days would suffer the same?
That's why I can't go to the cinema, a concert or even a wedding disco.
Cheers, T i m
Don't know is the short answer. While they are louder than a DD, its not a noise I have felt uncomfortable near, or had to reach for ear defenders. Its less offensive than a hammer drill drilling masonry IME.
Suck it and see (or hear) I think is the only way John.
Unfortunately, unless you have Tinnitus (and I wouldn't wish it on anyone, even the most rampantly fanatic Brexiteer!) you wouldn't know what noises can aggravate it.
Like, I have been exposed to some fairly loud noises, thought I was going to suffer the consequences but didn't, and some pretty low levels of noise and have?
And that is something I would definitely put some good quality ear defenders on before starting.
And I guess the noise level (or sound) can very depending on what you are using it on? Like a fence post outdoors or a cupboard, indoors where the shape could act like a sounding box or reflector.
Cheers, T i m
Rotational speed independant of the torque required to drive the screw in?
Rotational speed dependant only or trigger position?
Only enough torque delivered to maintain the rotational speed up to a seperate limit?
I think mine uses some form of PWM as speed control as it produces a fixed frequency whine at low speeds.
They certainly aren't, as I say my drill/driver is very tricky to use. It's OK for bashing screws in if your not overly bothered about the heads getting chewed, it caming out and the bit damaging the work or over driving the head into the work.
What make/model is your Fat Max?
Speed controllers vary - some will deliver decent torque at low revs, other less so. The modern brushless tools are probably best in that respect since they try to deliver constant rotational speed under a varying load.
And mine is a breeze. ;-)
I can use mine in that mode if I run it on speed II, set the clutch to OFF and just pull the trigger right in. Anything else means it's pretty controllable to half a turn of a screw?
It's a Stanley that I think is a re-badged DeWalt (or they are part of the same group now etc [1]). It's also quite heavy to a level that surprised most who are familiar with more basic power tools when they first pick it up.
Even when on SII and the clutch off and holding the keyless chuck firmly, gently squeezing the trigger allows you to determine just how much skin you want to pull off your hand. ;-(
Cheers, T i m
[1]"DeWalt (trademarked as D?WALT) is an American worldwide brand of power tools and hand tools for the construction, manufacturing and woodworking industries. DeWalt is a trade name of Black & Decker (U.S.) Inc., a subsidiary of Stanley Black & Decker."
Before this Stanley DD I previously had a DeWalt and would say it was nearly as good (but not as powerful). The only real reason I stopped using it was the batteries died.
Judging by some of the responses here, they must vary quite a bit! Also, how much they appear to vary could be down to the latent power / torque of the device in general. eg, if they are 'pretty torquy, then the speed controller can be more linear.
If you hold the chuck firmly with you hand and just slowly squeeze the trigger, I suggest most people would be forced to let go of it (for fear of taking skin off their hands) and when they do it would still only be doing a few RPM.
Mostly the cheaper offerings from what I've experienced so far. Even the DD daughter brought from Lidl (along with a circular and jig saw) works pretty well but isn't a patch on this FatMax.
I've not tried any brushless anything yet. [1]
Cheers, T i m
[1] A couple of mates fancied racing RC Electric cars and went out and spent quite a bit getting set up from scratch. I dragged out all my old stuff (NiMH, brushed motor) and we turned up at the local club (where I was a bit of a point of amusement because of all my old gear).Mates had written their cars off within the first couple of heats and I ended up 3rd in the main final (much to everyone's surprise, especially me!). ;-)
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