Denver Collects Fines On Drivers Who Stop At Red Lights

formatting link
>>

It's not very dangerous, but there has to be a definition of where to stop; to borrow a phrase, you have to draw a line somewhere.

The state of competence among American drivers, at least around here is shockingly bad - most people seem to feel the way you do about slightly crossing the white line about other "minor" infractions like not signaling, not using mirrors, forcing their way into another lane when it's occupied by other traffic, turning into the wrong lane, etc. etc. etc... unfortunately the only law that seems to be enforced is speeding.

nate

Reply to
Nate Nagel
Loading thread data ...

Old news combined with usual internet urban legend and fear mongering. Likely based in the already well underway effort to add data recorders to all new cars, and use the data from them for accident analysis. Some people don't like that, so there were discussions about if a warrant would be required to get the data. For cars with onstar or similar systems, the car already phones for help when certain things happen. I don't think there is enough headroom in cell system for all cars to report position constantly, even on a burst message basis. And a lot of country isn't covered by cell towers.

Sure, the technology to do all the various things already exists. LoJack can track and remote kill a car, OnStar can report location, etc, etc. It would not be a great leap to link all this stuff and tie it to the onboard computer and data recorder. And once all the old cars were off the road, it could eliminate most police chases- cop on scene could remotely read car's ID, transmit it uphill, and Big Brother in the cloud could just issue a command for the car to choke off fuel supply. Science fiction described such systems 50 years ago (although those cars could usually fly), but it hasn't happened yet. I hope it never does, for cost, additional failure mode, and constitutional reasons.

Reply to
aemeijers

More likely would be the stuff that counts your mileage and then phones home because gas taxes based on gallons isn't paying enough.

>
Reply to
Kurt Ullman

I disagree. This is another case of big govt screwing the citizens. Every prosecutor has discretion in determining charges to bring. For the police to be ticketing drivers because their front wheel just touches the white stop line is an abuse of power.

Also, I fail to see the slam against the media. It is a worthwhile and important story. Should not the people be aware of it, so that it will not happen to them? Isn't the purported claim of the police that this is being done for safety? If that's true, then it's important to get the message out, is it not?

As to the safety issue, it's been shown in city after city that these cameras have done nothing for safety. Many cities, like LA, are taking them out. So, there the citizens got screwed twice. Once by paying to put them in, then again by paying to take them out. And then those unfortunate enough to get a ticket got screwed a third time, because the cameras were ruled illegal and unenforceable in court, though most who got the tickets paid them.

Reply to
trader4

There have been numerous studies done where they have installed cameras at intersections and the conclusion in every one I've seen is that they had no effect on safety at all. LA is a good example. After spending taxpayer $$$ to install them, they are taking them out, part of the reason being they say there was no impact on safety.

L.A. traffic cameras may get the red light Citing costs and safety issues, the Police Commission votes to shut the cameras down. Unless the City Council intervenes, their use at 32 intersections could end within weeks. June 08, 2011|By Joel Rubin, Los Angeles TimesThe Los Angeles Police Commission has voted to kill the city's controversial red-light camera program, rejecting claims that the system makes streets safer while costing the city nothing.

Tuesday's vote means that the red-light cameras installed at 32 intersections throughout the city could stop operating within a few weeks unless the City Council takes the unusual step of stripping the Police Commission of its authority over the issue.

Reply to
trader4

On 4 Nov 2011 14:36:16 GMT, notbob wrote Re Re: Denver Collects Fines On Drivers Who Stop At Red Lights:

Well said.

Reply to
Caesar Romano

Don't you need a license to sling that much cognitive dissonance?

You have tickets for failure to obey a highway sign, and a cracked windshield.

And, of course, you have cited these same motorists to be "perfectly safe" at 80 mph, ad nauseum.

And, you're in a RLC thread.

You appear to be in the final stages of entirely disconnecting from reality. -----

- gpsman

Reply to
gpsman

I was just thinking of this lately. Do electric cars get away without paying highway taxes?

Reply to
Tony Miklos

They obviously don't pay taxes on the motor fuels. They would be subject to state taxes/fees like registration fee, that may go towards roads or tolls, etc. However those would be small in most cases compared to the fuel tax.

Reply to
trader4

that would be "speeding"

and a cracked

In my current state of residence, that windshield would be perfectly legal, and in any state it was safe. I was also cited literally days after the crack occurred.

No, I stated that 80 MPH on an interstate highway was perfectly safe for a competent driver, which it is.

You shouldn't talk about things that you know nothing about, like "reality."

I'll oppose a law when it is unfair. I will support a law when it makes sense.

nate

Reply to
Nate Nagel

How would it be collected (with today's infrastructure)? They don't use gas, so obviously don't pay the gas (road) tax.

Reply to
krw

Gas taxes, certainly. Unless hybrid, but even then you use about half the gas.

Reply to
Kurt Ullman

Right now they do in most states. It's kind of interesting, because many states have aggressive enforcement looking for people using farm diesel or #2 boiler fuel in diesel trucks to avoid road fuel taxes. That was also an issue with propane conversions.

Reply to
Robert Neville

It's not that hard - you just build it into the annual plate/registration/property tax.

formatting link

Reply to
Robert Neville

Sure, it *can* be done. The point is that it *ISN'T. The gas tax is a very simple use tax, though. It'll be hard to beat. There would be a revolution if people were charged thousands of dollars per year to register their cars. It's not as simple as the leftists propose.

Reply to
krw

I went to driver's school a few years ago after a fender bender to reduce the points, and other benefits.

I always had a question about entering an intersection when turning left. Do you enter, then wait out in the intersection, with your wheels turned left, until it is clear? Or wheels straight? You're a sitting duck for a speeding ambulance, police pursuit, rearender who will send you into oncoming traffic, whatever. If you stop back of the line, every car behind you honks.

I learned that YOU MUST NOT ENTER THE INTERSECTION UNTIL YOU CAN SAFELY MAKE YOUR TURN COMPLETELY. That would mean stopping behind the line. I have done that since, but before that, would sit out there, always having a feeling that I was doing something wrong, and always waiting and watching for something bad to happen. Another reason to get behind the line.

PLUS, I just love those people who cut the corner, coming through my left hand turn lane when they are making their LEFT hand turn. They must start their turn way before their own white line to get that far into my lane. Another reason for staying back behind the line.

Steve

Reply to
Steve B

"Ed Pawlowski" wrote

Yes, the mayor should ALWAYS drive a new car, and a better model than any citizen. It's just the right thing to do. I'll gladly pay $75 for going six inches over the line any day. I have no idea how much sleep I might lose if I were a scofflaw.

Steve

Reply to
Steve B

I'd say when the front bumper goes into the crosswalk would be a starter. But different cars have different amounts of overhang, so some cars could actually be on the line or over it, and NOT in the painted pedestrian crossing lines. I hate those people who stop at the second line in the crosswalk, and then give you a dirty look when you give them a dirty look and a one finger salute because you have to walk around their car and into the intersection.

Steve

Reply to
Steve B

They are available for people to put on their family buggies so they can keep tabs on their young drivers.

Steve

Reply to
Steve B

Don't believe that for a second. I lived in Texas and Louisiana, and I've seen many a trooper do a U turn from 70 mph on the Interstate to come back and get an expired sticker. They are color coded, and easily spotted. DAMHIKT

Steve

Reply to
Steve B

HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.