We haven't got the heart to shoot them. It's also illegal..... but we've been tempted. The plump sleek deer we sometimes see walking an old deerpath about 25 feet into the woods behind our house also look tasty. ;-)
The plants are not a good rich green color once planted out in the gardens. The get paler as summer passes. The soil is alkaline from natural limestone locking up any iron in the soil. By late summer they're almost chlorotic. That doesn't happen with Ironite. Also, our Hollies and Azaleas would die from chlorosis before we started using sulfur and Ironite. I did buy some stuff for Hollies and Azaleas this year. I didn't use the Ironite on them. But who knows what poisons are in any of these products? There's no way to know. How can I even know what's in the 10-10-10 I buy?
That depends on which scavenger you're talking about. Even humans can fit into that category. Insects and bugs are the worst garden pests here, not animals.
My quoted shipping was $11.50 cheapest way. You must live closer to the place. How large is your garden and how often do you spray it?
I understand. Where I live it's a poor droughty clay. We had to till in loads and loads of organic matter to grow anything. It was forest when I bought this land many years ago. It's only the last few years we're really getting into vegetable gardening. I just started canning again this year. Now that we're retired we have more time - but less money. :( We're living on SS and the few extra bucks he makes helping out a friend once a week or so. A a small savings account for emergency use. To someone working full time, or your average Yuppie, the cost of organic stuff is affordable. To the retired, unless they have "other income," it's just too darn expensive.
I have the same problem! I have to have everything shipped and that is not possible anymore. I even had to order a canner through Ace Hardware in town. I was surprised to find canning jars at Wal*Mart. This area of my county is no longer agricultural. Farmers give up in disgust to droughts and pest invasions and the high cost of fuel and pesticides. Where farms once were I see subdivisions full of Yuppies. Cattle farms have turned into huge shopping Malls. The stores cater to them... not to us looking for organic garden products. These newcomers hire Lawn Services and never dirty their hands.
How large is your garden and how often do you spray it?
Sometimes you just can¹t grow an acid loving plant in a alkaline area. Sure you can try to over ride this limitation but it requires energy aka money. AND the odds are not in your favor.
What state do you reside in?
I have to deal with Acid here in NJ.
Bill
For what relationship? ???
Why should I do that simply because I can't afford the things YOU can? Clue #1 - Not everyone has your income. :-)
I can only shop at the stores that are here. There's a nursery that carries bone and blood meal and I think they still have Fish Emulsion. It would be several hundred dollars to purchase enough for our gardens. People are not buying these high priced items. They're going for the bags of General Fertilizer and Ironite.
>
How nice! Nothing like that here. Clue #2 = not everyone has stores in their area that sell organic fertilizers.
You're kidding right? One gallon is enough FE for 3 container Tomatoes for one watering!
Are you retired and living on SS?
I am. ;-) I wanted to know your issues with the product. Has anyone died from using it in their gardens? Any children suffer from lead inhalation? Is it being found in veggies grown in soil containing Ironite? I ask a question and I get a load of people suggesting I purchase all kinds of expensive products only those with good incomes can afford. I took people's advice on another Forum to use Organics when the insect infestation started and wasted over $30 on Neem Oil and Pyrethrum. Neither product made a difference. All they did was give the insects an unbeatable head start (as I waited for results) and destroy the garden. By the time I turned to chemicals it was too late. The plants were totally overrun with spider mites and whitefly.
Organic fertilizers do not keep insect infestations from occurring.
Oh, I wonder how other sites keep their prices listed then. This is the first site I've been to in years that doesn't list prices. How am I to know how many lbs of feathers or other amendments to buy? What rule are you going by? Lets say for 1000 sq ft garden.
Alas, I don't have your income and you seem frustrated that not everyone can afford organic gardening. Why does it bother you so that not everyone has that kind of money? There was no info there as to how much the products are or how much is needed for the average garden. So tell me since you're familiar with the prices... how much would I need for 1000 sw ft garden and about how much would it cost?
Yep, unexpected emergencies. Family issues. Job loss. Two serious accidents in the recent past. High cost of living. We're not all as fortunate as someone like you.
Since when is LEAD poisoning and IRON poisoning the same thing? Where's the connection? You're confusing the two elements.
But the subject is/was Ironite and the lead it contains. Who the hell would feed their child Ironite?
The theory is that lack of organic nutrients stresses the plants, and insect pests are attracted to stressed-out plants. The latter part seems to be true. The first part is a little iffy but it's not totally false either.
Bob
Is you joshin'? It's too expensive to not have to buy lots of harmful chemicals for the garden? Or do you mean you can't afford to waist money on the rarely needed natural products (which tend to cost the same or less than any other product for the same use) when you have to save funds for lots of costly chemical swill?
On organically balanced garden with diverse plant species needs no artificial soil ammendments and is less inclined to pest or disease problems, incurring few costs. A garden that is out of balance (probably from chemical use) will be more rather than less susceptible to return of diseases and pests (for many reasons, such as the fact that harmful insects bounce back more quickly than the beneficial insects pesticides also eradicate), inducing the "need" for further purchases of costly harmful chemicals.
In short, organic gardening is gardening on the cheap! Non-organic methods feed into themselves -- expense builds on expense.
-paghat the ratgirl
I killed filed Marie enough is enough.
Bill
Oh, this explains it. You are trying to grow plants which absoltely detest those conditions. If you use 1/4 cup of black strap molassas with 1/2 cup of epsom salts to a gallon of water you will be providing the iron you need. The magnesium helps unlock to soils iron. There is plenty there. Ironite, if used, should only be used once every three to five years or you risk overdoing it. Ironite kills soil biota which is far more important than using Ironite to green things up. If you use a quality fertilizer like Medina you will be in a much better position. However, you've come up with many excuses or reasons to continue using Ironite so maybe this discussion should end. It's a waste of time.
Humans are not scavengers. Scavengers eat anything, including carion. Humans are omnivores and we're on the top of the food chain.
So have I.
I'm on limestone rock in TN. As the Azaleas died I haven't replaced them. The Hollies are doing great in their mix of compost, sand, clay soil and Ironite. Now that we have the Internet I look up plants before I buy them. They shouldn't be selling plants here that need acid soil.
Magnesium (Epsom Salts) is added at planting time for the veggies and flowers. No more shrubs will be planted as they need too much water in this climate.
Ironite, if used, should only be used once every
I found no sites showing Ironite kills soil biota, frogs, turtles, birds, earthworms, grubs or anything else that may wander into a garden.
If you use a quality fertilizer like Medina you will be in a much
Unless you can prove that to me, and then loan me several hundred dollars to buy it - why push it on me? So far I've tried several organic things that someone on these groups and forums told me worked and it was bullcrap. Then when these expensive useless products don't work, you pro-organic fanatics get pissed off and insist they worked for their mother's neighbor's son's father-in-law's cousin.........
Why didn't you just answer the questions I asked in stead of trying to push your favorite soil amendments off on me? I already have several loads of free organic matter to go into the garden this fall. How many people have been sickened or killed by Ironite? Where are the statistics children are somehow ingesting lead from Ironite treated soil? Where are the studies? Very little Ironite is needed. You seem to think 50lb sacks are dumped in the gardens. One coffee can full does one whole garden for the season.
OK, we don't have wolves here but do have Buzzards. The buzzies don't bother gardens. Humans in their natural state will eat almost anything other than carrion.
And this has WHAT to do with the issues concerning the use of Ironite?
That's all it is - a theory. I've been gardening since 1958 and have seen insects attracted to the healthiest plants you can imagine. Pests are opportunists. If they're in the area they will attack plants be they healthy or unhealthy.
The latter part
And it's not totally true either. My gardens are loaded with organic matter, yet this year the insects in one garden are totally uncontrollable. I should have used a good chemical spray as soon as I saw the first insects and spiders in stead of wasting several weeks with organic oils and powders that did nothing. All they did was give the pests a good head start, to the point the garden was a total loss by the time the ag agent recommended a good chemical spray. More organic matter will be added this fall and for no other reason than to help our heavy clay soil support veggies.
In article , "Marie Dodge" wrote:.
Sounds like you've never gotten past the idea that you have to dose the garden with SOMETHING chemical and are dissatisfied with "organic oils and powders" as an option. Organic gardening is not about store products, one ailse for the greenies, three ailses for the people who don't care how much damage they do to the environment. All aisles are equally about tricking people into unnecessary purchases.
Organic home gardening is about balance. A butterfly garden intentionally includes plants butterfly larvae will eat, and the adult butterflies will get nectar and lay eggs. No one says "oh god the butterflies are eating my garden, I have to kill all the butterflies!" though their larvae certainly are eating there. It's about BALANCE so no one insect becomes so numerous a garden is injured. You've obviously been using toxic chemicals so long that you would have to learn patience as well as good gardening practices to begin to restore a baolance.
You've killed foremost the BENEFICIAL insects so OF COURSE harmful ones rush back into their ecological niches and to their favorite plants with no natural predators remaining. The predator insects EVENTUALLY return if you stop killing poisoning their, and your, environment.
A healthy balanced garden does not need chemical fixes. A healthy garden will never arise from putting toxic chemicals into it. Every time you dewscribe another problem that "forces" you to use poisons, you're describing the result of bad gardening practices which can indeed result in an endless "battle" with "weapons" in the war zone you've established. My gardens are places of peace and rarely any upsets. I require no pesticides whether marketed in the organic aisle or the harmful-gardeners aisle. You could turn your war zone into a peaceful garden if you'd restore an organic balance and stop re-toxifying the place every time you get the negative results virtually all toxifiers get.
-paghat the ratgirl
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