It's not that new... I got a few boxes of those things
with the "Deck Master" kit I bought back in 2001.
They require a special and very hard to find bit...
For the life of me, I can't imagine the "why" on this
Greg D. wrote:
The why is easy. Phillips screws require a lot more inward pressure to
prevent cam out and the Robertson screw square head tends to snap off bits.
The screws were designed to keep the production level up. If the ability to
do the job is as good as they claim, then the market will dictate that the
The price of the bits or the drivers is cheaper if you consider how fast one
scraps Phillips bits.
If you are not part of the solution, you are not dissolved in the solvent.
Really? I've never snapped off a Robertson bit or screw head, and I've
driven screws that took both hands to resist the torque of the power driver.
I can only imagine that you were either screwing into something really
hard with an impact driver (in which case it should be pre-drilled), or
else the bit had a manufacturing flaw.
Actually proper use of an impact drive is actually easier on the head of a
screw. Trying to drive a screw farther than it should be driven with an
impact driver can cause a break as with any type driver.
3 weeks ago I built an entire deck cover using the less than ideal common
Deck Screws and used an impact driver to drive the majority of that 5 lb.
box of those 3" screws I broke no screws but did break 2 bit drivers
because of an improper union of the screw and bit. This happened on the
I have broken several square head screws with a 9.6 volt drill usually
because the screw was too small for the application or the wood was too hard
for the size screw.
I much prefer a torx--you can get the drivers at Sears or Home Depot or any
auto parts store, and Lox doesn't look to be any kind of major improvement
over it. Sure, that business about locking onto the bit sounds good, but a
decent magnetic driver handles that with just about any screw except solid
brass, bronze, or some types of stainless.
Actually if you buy quality screws a square drive bit and screw lock
together with out the need of a magnet driver. I very often have to "Yank"
on the drill to get the bit and screw to part. This is not to say that Torx
is any better or worse but that if the Lox holds the bit better than a good
square drive screw it may be more of a nuisance to use.
Yes, I know this. Torx does not lock together reliably. Hence the magnetic
driver. I tried square drive. If I had not used Torx first I might have
liked square drive, but using "good" drivers and "good" screws (I'm assuming
that what McFeelys sells is "good") I found that I was getting results only
marginally better than Phillips.
YES, McFeeleys sells good screws. Don't mistake their screws for what you
find in the Borg or misfitting Deck Screws. Typically you can plug the
screw on to the bit and the swing the drill around, up, down, backwards,
forward, in, out, and the screw stays put. Very handy in tight situations
or when you have to stretch to reach something and you can only use one hand
to start and drive the screw. Then after driving the screw you typically
have to give the drill a yank or wiggle to part he screw and bit. Removing
square drive screws can be a bit of a problem at times. The screw is stuck
on the bit and hotter than a fire cracker after removing it. Sometimes
tapping the side of the screw is not enough to get it to drop off of the
I used the Torx screws in the automotive business and that screw really
improved the replacement of sealed beams not to mention all the other parts.
With the sealed beams being spring loaded the old Philips head screws
holding the retaining ring were a PIA to remove.
To make carpenters swear (even more), I'd imagine.
When I put up a deck for my parents this summer, all the deck screws
were combo drives (like a phillips with a square head in the middle.)
They work great- but one bit comes in a 5-lb box. After losing a
couple, I was down to one, and went back to buy some bits- Surprise!
They don't carry them. You have to buy another box of screws to get
the drivers. So, they ended up being funny looking #2 squareheads for
the rest of the project.
Looks like these Lox ones are even worse- no fudging there and using
something that is almost as good, you *have* to use the proprietary
Even if they're awesome, I think I'll pass- at least until they start
selling the bits in the bins at the checkout of the hardware store
with the phillips and squareheads.
Proprietary $ucks for the most part ... and to do it with screw bits, so
that you can only buy the bits with the screws, is so much the "numb nut
corporate mentality" that it hurts.
... "when will they every learn?".
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