Anybody get the book?

[Larry Jaques]

On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 14:18:15 GMT, the inscrutable "Maverick" spake:

Just Say No!

Please remember that you never have to pay to return something someone sends to you unsolicited. If they bill you for it, request a return postage label. Some places, like Amazon, have ways of doing this online. I was able to print one for returning the book in minutes.

Yes, the book clubs with their auto-shipping policies sucker millions out of unsuspecting customers each year. That tactic sucks, but if you don't stand up to them, it will continue to happen.

- They who know the truth are not equal to those who love it. -Confucius ---

Comprehensive Website Programming Services

[Phil Anderson]

I'm glad to see that Steve Shanesy stepped up, already. I'm almost positive this came from Woodworkers Journal, not Popular Woodworking. At least, the book that I got came from WJ. I also received several requests for payment even though I never ordered the book. Very sleazy and makes me think I may not want to continue my subscription to WJ. I keep expecting some kind of apology from them for this marketing approach. Phil Visit my Web site

[Hank Gillette]

I fairness to PW, they weren't the one who sent it. It was sent by Woodworker's Journal. Personally, I'm not offended at all. They can send me all the unsolicited books they want. I'll keep them all.

[Mutt]

Reading all this with interest, I am highly offended at these tactics and the only way they'll stop is if you whack them a couple of times. It also struck me that here in NJ they have this consumer fraud statute which allows for treble damages and attorney fees, and this tactic seems to fall within its prohibitions. I wish they'd send one to me and then try to bill me for it; I'd whip up a lawsuit so fast and sue them for three times the $9 plus the fees of a lawyer acquaintance of mine (@$300/hr) just to make them hire a lawyer to defend the case. Let's see, about 3 hours to research and draft the complaint, another 4 hours for a summary judgment motion, 4 hours to appear and argue the motion....it all adds up.

Mutt

[Mark & Juanita]

Except that Intuit is as sleazy as the mag publishers. Examples include their recent letter to Quicken users, "sunsetting" anything other than their new version that has less features and is loaded with more ads and "phone home" features than the versions being sunsetted. I had used TurboTax for a number of years until 3 years ago when they tried their "product activation" scheme that limited use to a single computer, jeopardized the ability to recover records, and used a protection scheme that was highly dubious (i.e. had many characteristics of spyware). I migrated to TaxCut and have been satisfied with it as well, it's as easy to use and thus far they don't treat their customers like criminals. (Take a look at ed foster's gripe line and do a search on turbotax for some better detail than I can type in a few seconds. Ed Foster writes for Infoworld. Unfortunately, it looks like there are only allusions to the earlier activation/spyware incident, most of what is there is more recent things that Intuit is doing (e.g. won't import from soon-to-be-sunsettted Quicken versions and reduced functionality). Here is a link from the original Intuit behavior: Note that the complaints here are not that Intuit was protecting its software, but how and the effects it had on honest folks.

+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ The absence of accidents does not mean the presence of safety Army General Richard Cody +--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+

[Mark & Juanita]

Sand hills that insult you or make fun of you when you fall off your dirt bike. :-)

+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ The absence of accidents does not mean the presence of safety Army General Richard Cody +--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+

[Swingman]

Ditto here ... my CD for 2004 came sometime before Christmas.

[Swingman]

They're out to get _you_! :)

I've been using them for better than 10 years and never had that problem.

[Swingman]

Yep ... I heartily dislike Intuit, and particularly QuickBooks ... have used the latter exclusively for about ten years for my Internet company. Intuit definitely sucks since they took over with their corporate attitude and MSFT programming mentality.

However, I started with TaxCut years ago for my personal taxes and then moved over to TurboTax, I have never regretted the move ... _yet_.

That said, I load it at the last minute, do my taxes, and get that crap off my computer as fast as I can. The Discs/now CDs go in with the years receipts and a print out of all the worksheets.

I could care less whether I ever see it again, nor would I ever have a need to load it again.

[Larry Bud]

They've completely abandoned that type of production activation.

[mac davis]

Unless the law has been changed, you have no obligation to return anything that you didn't request..

mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

[WD]

Try to cancel it and see what I mean, just try it....

[CW]

If they sent it to you and you did not order it, it's yours.

[Rob Mills]

[Barry Lennox]

You are correct, total sleaze. However, don't send it back, it's yours. While living in CT a few years back, I had this with the infamous "Cue-cat" (If you don't know what this is, do a Google search, it's really quite funny) The local PO chief showed me an extract from his manual of regs and rules. If it's unsolicited, it's yours after some time. 30 or 90 days, IIRC. You don't have to do anything, except count the days.

Barry Lennox

[grumble]

I don't know, but maybe there's something in the terms and conditions of your subscription that allows them to do this and therefore implies that the book is not unsolicited. i.e. "We may from time to time send you items that we think might be of interest etc." or am I just paranoid.

[Maverick]

Maybe that's why I said this:

[Hank Gillette]

Well they actually say on the form "Because you didn't ask for this special book, you don't have to participate or send it back".

[Prometheus]

It is a little sleazy, but it can be useful if the books are worthwhile. I'm not a subscriber to Popular Woodworking, so I didn't get that one, but I do subscribe to Woodsmith, and buy the books they send me every month or so. There's no real discount to doing it that way, but it's a nice easy way to build of my woodworking library, and they've come in handy a couple of times already. I guess the biggest difference in the strategy of the two publishers is that to get the monthy books from woodsmith, I had to actually fill out and mail in a card- they didn't just send it to me without asking. Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

[Prometheus]

Yeah, it's amazing how one or two magazine subscriptions can turn into

5 or 6 bills- I subscribe to Discover, Popular Mechanics and Woodsmith, and I get a bill from some other magazine at least once a month. Wood magazine keeps sending me invoices, as well as Popular Woodworking and a couple of others. But- I don't actually believe that the magazines have much to do with it. I ordered Discover and Popular Mechanics directly via the subscription cards that come in the magazines, and I don't get any bills for similar magazines- Woodsmith, I ordered from a magazine clearinghouse online, and I get deluged by offers related to woodworking. Seems to me it's the clearinghouse that is doing the sleazy work- not necessarily the magazines themselves.

Aut inveniam viam aut faciam