I know that to be the case in Ontario, and I'm pretty sure in all of Kanuckistan. New houses have warranties as well. But ifyou have a 1000 sq-ft house and decide to add 4000 sq-ft, you're on your own with the contractor. (Still needs to meet code though.)
Anyone can install wiring. That's why there are inspectors. Same with plumbing. Natural Gas fitters are a different story, for all the obvious reasons.
You need a 3-phase power if your cutterhead on your jointer has 3 blades.
r
That oughtta be good for another 50 posts..LOL
Good one, Larry.
*Still laughing* r
I hope it didn't worry! I'm sure another electron would find it positively attractive.
While one may wire a circuit for a specific tool, the circuit doesn't know hat. Not might others who subsequently own that circuit (as when they purchase the home).
Circuits installed in homes are, therefore, just 110/120VAC or 220/240VAC circuits terminated with breakers and receptacles that would appear to indicate the design amperage but in no way indicate which "tool" the installer initially had in mind when adding the run out to the portion of the home the installer might have used for a workshop or sauna - who knows?
I bought a hoe that saw its share of homebrew re-wiring all of which may well have minimally served the installer at the moment but had seen adapted to serve uses beyond the limits a strict interpretation of the electrical codes I'd come across in dealing with several inspections and inspectors in South Florida over the years.
As I cannot find the NEC on-line (save in offers to sell me a copy for sixty bucks or so), I've been unable to find and cite the advice recalled from various and sundry wiring projects involving City Electrical Inspectors who were able to quote me the relevant code at the time.
So, I may well be advocating over kill in insisting that OP consider running
10/3 out to his shop to support a motor that only demands two hot conductors and an equipment ground to actually operate (indeed, will do so without running the equipment ground others have chimed in to support installing).Part of my issue, aside from exculpation clauses in insurance policies an the potential liability to a subsequent purchaser under law, was the practical matter of expending the additional cash to cover the cost of the neutral conductor out to the intended outlet in anticipation of the one constant all reasonable wood workers can agree upon - change.
As, if and when I can find the code book, I shall look up a residential
240VAC circuit and report what I find verbatim (since no one else seems to have access to the code to do so not withstanding the ad hominid attacks in response to my prudent suggestions herein.So for those vociferous folks who would find me so fallible and my advice to go with 10/3 rather tan 10/2) so offensive, ignorant and objectionable as to warrant attacks on my credibility, intelligence and motives, let me agree to disagree an leave it there.
I must admit that the insurance and legal points made were a bit "out there" in the sense that such cases seldom arise unless the loss of life is significant and the pockets of the liable party are obviously deep.
But, in my defense, we were notified that the crack in the pane of the window in our garage would result in the cancellation of our policy if not corrected in two weeks! Good thing they had not inspected my electrical wiring eh?
Before one blithely assumes he is "covered" by his homeowners, perhaps a review of what happened to all those folks in Louisiana an the Gulf Coast after the Hurricane. Disputes over whether rising water or wind-driven water caused the damages with the majority of the insured walking away with little or nothing despite their coverage. Talk about your exculpation clauses!
What if the motor of the intended device would operate upon two twelve's - would that be OK as well?It would be less expensive.
I suspect the OP has long since abandoned reading this thread as I should and will forthwith as my intent was not to antagonize those with as much time on their hands as I but to offer well-intended advice to a fellow carpenter the result of which could not be assailed as unsafe, dangerous, nor imprudent only unnecessary.
"Unless stipulations are noted, houses are sold "as is"."
You may so stipulate in the contract, but the law does not allow one to escape liability by making such broad declarations. If you know the wiring is faulty ( an potentially dangerous condition exists and that the fault would not be readily apparent (e.g. is hidden) a good attorney could get you not withstanding your "as-is" declaration.
Of course, if the house were sold as a virtual tear-down - uninhabitable at closing, for instance, your "as-is" declaration would have more effect. But if you sol a home that was apparently fully functional and habitation upon closing was clearly anticipated by the purchaser, you might find the declaration ineffective at court were he family to have been burned alive in an electrical ire resulting for thief use of a defective electrical circuit you installed and did not declare during negotiations.
e.g. you cannot legally hide a dangerous condition and escape liability with a broad declaration. Under USC every product carries an implied warranty of suitability for intended use.
I won a case against General Motors years ago in West Palm Beach based upon the claim that, despite the expiration of the warranty, the defect was created at the point of manufacture and remained hidden for several years (e.g. something no inspection absent a complete dismantle could have found) until the leak materialized and my vehicle no longer kept out the rain.
The case remains in the Public Record. The case also serves the point that the dollar value is most significant in the decision to sue or seek overturning a decision.
GM may well have believed they might prevail in an appeal (as I was unable to afford an attorney) but likely decided the effort was not cost effective.
Had I tried a class action, we might have seen a more vigorous response from the automaker as the potential claim would have risen to millions of dollars in fees alone.
Congress has seen fit to change the laws to make it more difficult for you and I to bring a suit and to limit liability when we do. But, if the stakes are high enough, one can find an attorney willing to take it on and find a reading of that insurance policy or sales contract upon which he might prevail.
Equipment is typically provided by its manufacturer with a plug that is appropriate to that equipment -- a plug which prevents connection of that equipment to a receptacle that is not suitable.
You'll excuse me, I'm sure, if I smile a little bit here, as your previous posts don't indicate any degree of familiarity at all with the NEC, or indeed with residential wiring practices in general.
Right here:
You didn't just insist that he "consider" it -- you insisted that it was required by Code.
You haven't cited any of those, either.
That won't be necessary -- simply citing the relevant article and section will do, since all of us have the same access to it on-line that you do.
Again, the full 2005 NEC is at
You haven't made any "prudent suggestions" -- just uninformed claims about supposed Code requirements that do not in fact exist.
You've ruined your own credibility by making unfounded and erroneous claims about phantom "requirements".
Great applet. It could benefit from a search engine however!
Thanks
Can we p l e a s e get a grip here? Wiring a 240V table saw without a neutral conductor is COMPLETELY CODE-COMPLIANT. Nothing wrong with the practice whatsoever. There isn't even any place on a 240V table saw where you can connect the damn neutral wire if you have one! 240V loads DO NOT need a neutral.
[Above applies to North America]"And... who is liable for damages if there is a house fire? Here it comes...THE INSURANCE COMPANY."
No, the insurance company isn't liable. The ISURED PARTY is liable. The Insurance company has contracted to assume some portion of the damages assessed to the INSURED PARTY after which, the INSURED PARTY is responsible for the difference.
They have simply agreed to reimburse the insured for a portion of claims (after the deductible) and often to assume theresponsibility of taking thecase to court or settling. If you sustain a million dollar judgment plus fees and had a half-million of coverage, you will be responsible for the balance "out of pocket." This because you, the insured, are liable for your acts and omissions.
And, if your insurance company can prove that you did not adhere to the contract for insurance, they can walk away, leaving you responsible for the entire judgment.
Stuff they did not teach in Wood shop, but important none the less.
Stay cool. the OP is a troll. probably somebody's sockpuppet. out having a good time. only way to get rid of them is to not feed them.
"Robatoy" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@j44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
Oh what to do! I'm currently wrestling with my used right tilt Unisaw that I recently upgraded to, but my black leads are going to the left side screws on the 240volt receptacles. I'm afraid they must go to the right side screw terminals, so I guess I have to get rid of it and get a left tilt saw to match my wiring. By the way which is better left or right tilt saws.
And now Rob says I need 3 phase power. The DJ-20 that BARRY made me aware of says it is single phase on the motor, but it has three cutter heads. If I upgrade to three phase power what happens if I then upgrade to a spiral cutter head, will I need 60K power for all those multiple cutters?
And now I'm going to do my dust collection. So I have heavy walled spiral pipe and fittings along with blast proof Kevlar hoses (yes I'm not kidding .... but they were a freebie)but do I need to ground the bags on the collector itself; after all they are only fabric and the dust in them is not grounded. The complexity and danger of it all, good thing I read the Wreck daily :)
Jerry
Nonononoooo. Use spade lugs. Most garden supply stores will sell them. Left tilt, right tilt.. whaddisthis a frickin' pinball? Kidding. The left tilt is better.
You can get around that by getting a frequency converter. Either solid state or an old motor/generator set. With all them cutters, you'll need to get the frequency way up, and as far as I know, only the power supply of a Tupolev jet-liner has an M/G set that will work. They can be had.
DUDE!! Ground the bags... do it now!!! If too many electricals build up in the corner of the bag, and you touch it.. your bag can blow right off!
It could happen....
r --->who thinks that our friends Down Under have to reverse to a right-tilt.
Here is a start.
We're trying to create money from nothing.
And chicks are free, only if ...
But if you are a citizen of USA you do cause it is government of the people, no what they do use paper and ink.....
Mark (sixoneeight) = 618
What, you live some place that's still on the gold standard?
Nah coal standard generally, bit of corn too. Southern Illinois.
Mark (sixoneeight) = 618
"Swingman" wrote in news:8c6dna3wN- yJaeLYnZ2dnUVZ snipped-for-privacy@giganews.com:
Not the chicks I used to know.
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