A discovery: Inserting Threaded Inserts

Page 1 of 2  
I made a new (router) dado jig this morning. My old one was made in haste for a bookcase project. It worked fine, especially once I made it (more easily) adjustable, but it's not long enough for a project I have in mind.
To adjust the dado width, I used threaded (female) inserts and star knobs. The last time I used those inserts I had a devil of a time getting them into the wood. Some people here suggested cutting the head off a 1/4-20 bolt, chucking it into a drill, and threading a pair of nuts onto it as a back stop.
That sounded like a good idea, and I was just about to cut the head off a bolt when another idea struck me. I threaded the insert onto the knob itself, all the way to the body of the knob. Then I turned the insert into the wood by hand with the knob. When the knob touched the wood, I backed the knob out of the insert.
To my surprise, it really was flush with the wood, but I turned it in another half-turn with a screwdriver anyway. In retrospect, I could have eliminated that step by putting a washer (one whose outer diameter was smaller than the insert) onto the knob threads before putting on the insert.
It's probably not a better method than the one suggested here if you're doing a lot of them, but it worked fine.
--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/13/2015 11:45 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:

I have had too many crack without that pressure.
--
Jeff

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/13/2015 12:50 PM, woodchucker wrote:

I don't think I would describe the force I used as "extreme". But I see your point.
--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/13/2015 10:45 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:

Taking those two statements together makes me wonder if you're installing them upside down?
Most likely not, but you never know ... so don't take offense.
--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/13/2015 4:52 PM, Swingman wrote:

facing up. I suppose if esthetics was a concern, the other way might be preferable, but this seems to work fine.
--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Notch up, there is even a drill insertion bit that engages those slots.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/14/15 12:36 AM, Leon wrote:

A drill is about the only way I can get them in straight. No matter what technique I try to use, when I do it by hand there is inevitably some angle to them when I'm finished because of having to stop turning while pushing to reposition the hand. Those suckers reeeeally want to go in crooked. A drill is the only way I seem to be able to hold them perfect;y straight while driving them in.
--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/14/2015 10:50 AM, -MIKE- wrote:

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/13/2015 4:47 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:

Actually, the notches are designed to facilitate the cutting of the threads and should go down in hardwoods.
Do it that way in hardwoods and you'll never go back.
From a catalog for threaded inserts designed for use in wood:
"For most wood applications including medium-hard and hardwood, the threaded insert should be installed slot down. The cutting action at the slotted section allows easier installation and avoids radial stresses which may otherwise tend to split the wood."
"In soft wood, the threaded insert should be installed slot up. The threaded insert is then thread forming, similar to a wood screw. The absence of cutting provides a firm anchor in the relatively soft wood."
--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/14/2015 7:23 AM, Swingman wrote:

Do you have a picture of the insert in question? I have some old brass inserts with the slots. Anyway there are apparently numerous styles of threaded inserts. I pretty much get the zinc style these days with a flared top.
Here are my insertion instructions for my brass slotted inserts. Specifically they want the slots up so that the special threads hold better.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/21223439508/in/dateposted-public/
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/14/15 8:46 AM, Leon wrote:

The answer is in the picture. Yours doesn't have the threads coming up all the way to the top-- it is rounded and smooth all the way around. If you look at the one diagrammed in those instructions, you will see the the threads come all the way to the top, with the slot dissecting the threads. That insert style would definitely cut hardwood when being driven slot-side down. They are also the ones I always break bits off of at that particular section when trying to drive them with a flat-head! :-D
--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/14/2015 10:58 AM, -MIKE- wrote:

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/14/2015 8:23 AM, Swingman wrote:

thanks for the tip.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/14/2015 8:23 AM, Swingman wrote:

Oh, and the "devil of a time" comment was mostly due to trying to put the insert in with a slot screwdriver. It was the widest one I had, but still a tad narrower than it needed to be. It was just wide enough to grab both slots - a little - but slipped out often. It's also difficult to get it started plumb that way. My "new method" was much better.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/14/2015 8:53 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:

As he and I both have pointed out, there are several types of inserts with the slot. Mine are specifically to be used with the slot up, some can be used wither way. If yours are intended to to be used either way using a screw driver might be more problematic. OR you need to get a decent set of screw drivers. :~)
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

The only inserts I've ever seen that go in slot-down are the press-in style you find in cheap furniture (and in those the slot is intended to allow the insert body to flex, it's not for driving).
Like Greg, I found the Hillman brand inserts (the ones stocked by Home Depot and Lowes) to be undrivable with a screwdriver, despite that evidently being the manufacturers intention, due to the slot not being well formed - a screwdriver with a tip thick enough to fit the slot well is wider than the insert (also, the metal is weak, due to the slot being so wide, and likely to break if you exert any force on the slot).
If you can find them, the style with a hex recess are far and away the best inserts (and, obviously, go in hex-upwards).
John
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/14/2015 10:14 AM, John McCoy wrote:

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/14/2015 8:53 AM, Greg Guarino wrote:

Don't take anyone's word for it, try it yourself.
Learn to do it this way and, if you want ease of use and accuracy, I guarantee you will never go back doing it any other way:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIhEqoKE8Dc

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/14/2015 4:00 PM, Swingman wrote:

outer perimeter of the insert and in the threads. The ones I have are not.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

... hope I didn't read your post wrong ?
http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/page.aspx?pe133&cat=1,180,42334
.. is this what you need ?
John T.
--- ---
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Related Threads

    HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.