OT - poison ivy

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"Bob S." wrote: ....

Wasn't 2,4-D or 2,4,5-T then. Both are broadleaf selective and they breakdown in the soil or water within 2-3 weeks at most. Found the following quickly for 2,4,5-T and my recollection is 2,4-D is similar in nature.
"Fate         2,4,5-T on the soil may be degraded chemically or biologically, volatilized, absorbed in the soil, or leached beyond the depth of plant roots. 2,4,5-T is moderately mobile in sandy and clay soils. Half-life on grass is 8-17 days, in soils 21-24 days. Normally, only small amounts enter water, where it does not persist as it is absorbed by clay or biota within a few days,. Esters of 2,4,5-T are usually hydrolysed within a few days. There is no significant bioaccumulation."
Extracted from
Rotterdam Convention - Operation of the Prior Informed Consent Procedure for Banned or Severely Restricted Chemicals
    Decision Guidance Documents
    2,4,5-T and its salts and esters     
BTW, as an aside, the prime toxicological effect supporting the ban was listed as the dioxin contaminant as another poster noted.
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Alan wrote:

Only if you're going to be digging around in it...if it's dead it ain't coming after you. (That is, if it's not a gardening area, I'd not worry about digging it out after I had killed it).
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Doug Miller wrote:

Some (i.e. the manfacturer) say the dioxin was an impurity. Other's say it is the 2,4,5,T itself, or at least a by-product of the manufacturing process.
"Army scientists found that by mixing 2,4-D and 2,4,5-trichlorophenoxyacetic acid (2,4,5-T) and spraying it on plants, there would be an almost immediate negative effect on the foliage. What they didn't realize, or chose to ignore, was that **2,4,5-T contained dioxin,** a useless by-product of herbicide production. It would be twenty more years until concern was raised about dioxin, a chemical the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) would later call "one of the most perplexing and potentially dangerous" known to man."
Bob S.
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Duane Bozarth wrote:

Used in the correct strengths for residential application on grasses, the stated results are probably correct. But used in military strengths to obliterate whole jungles is another matter altogether.
Bob S.
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I thought the biggest problem with exposure to Agent Orange was the traces of dioxin present as an impurity.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt. And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?
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NEVER NEVER NEVER burn poison ivy. Great- you're not downwind. How about everyone else? Also, the oil can remain active for years- even decades.
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Killing it is not enough- it must be removed by the roots. I hire someone else to do it, but if you can't, follow this link:
http://www.whyy.org/91FM/ybyg/poisonivy.html
Scroll down the page. There is a 7 step procedure.
BTW, the advice in other messages is full of errors. For example, the oil is water-soluble, not water repellant. Don't use soap (at first- see the link). Don't EVER burn poison ivy.
Good luck!
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"Bob S." wrote: ....

He put on liquid concentrate in enough volume to saturate everything including the ground for five years? Seems like he must have had a 55 gal drum of the stuff.
I've spilled while filled the sprayer full concentrate and while it will kill all, there certainly will be regrowth by the following year.
1/2-life ~ 3 wks --> ~17 half-lives/year * 5 yrs ==> 85 half-lives --> 2^-85 ~ 2E-26 initial concentration at that time. 2^-17 ~ 8E-6 after one year. If it was still totally dead after that, I'd still say it was something other than (or in addition to) 2,4-D/2,4,5-T
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This is Turtle
This is not tring anything but doing what all the loggers in the early 1900 was doing to get away from the effects of PI. Modern medication now days have cures for anything but they all have a Patient on it and the berrys don't. Just like up till 1940 the cure for food poisin was vinegar but they developed a patiented medication to fix this and just forgot about vinegar.
I can not take a stand on saying it is safe or not by taking 3 berry of the PI but driving on a free way is dangerous too. Now I don't recommend anything here and anything I do you should not do !
TURTLE
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Allergies are funny things.
Some people never react to PI (a friend of my son's for instance).
Children often evolve out of (or into) allergies, it seems common for that to occur around puberty (ie: recent research on severe peanut allergies going away completely by themselves in early teens in about 20-30% of cases).
With most severe allergies, the first time you come in contact with the item, nothing happens, but you've been sensitized for the next contact, and they often get progressively worse. Yet, given enough time without contact, the sensitization sometimes resets. [My wife gets a free wasp sting every few years, but if the interval is too short, watch out!]
There are many old-timer remedies for poison ivy. PI tea. Berries. Smoking or eating PI leaves etc. The fact is that urushiol is present in all portions of the plant, and that when taken internally the results can be MUCH more catastrophic than a skin rash. Inhaling the smoke has effects roughly akin to mustard gas or chlorine used in chemical warfare, only a bit slower.
Yes, allergy treatments often are nothing more than progressively larger micro-doses of the allergen in an attempt to habituate your body to it.
But wolfing back 3 berries? There's really no telling what the urushiol dose is going to be - given how much damage just touching a leaf can do, I certainly wouldn't risk swallowing the stuff.
I think you were just one of those people who'd have become immune to PI at that age, berries or not. It's also probable that the tougher your skin is, the less likely you'll be to get affected.
I seem to be able to touch PI with my hands/palms with no effect, but if I touch somewhere (or someone :-( else after I've been in contact with PI, ouch!
--
Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est
It\'s not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.
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wrote:

This Is Turtle.
At Any Farm & Feed Store or even at Super Walmarts store . Any Farm & Feed Store Man will tell you all about the 2-4-D stuff and what is what. You should be carful for this stuff can get you just like the weeds if not handled right.
TURTLE
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