Tapping machine threads in wood

I saw a video a while back; the Wood Whisperer, I think. He was tapping some holes in wood, for what purpose I have forgotten. He claimed that the results were pretty strong, which surprised me. Machine threads seemed too shallow for wood.

As it happens, I have a set of taps; two actually. I didn't buy either of them. A retired electrician friend of mine gave me a set when I was dealing with yet another no-longer-standard (if it ever was) electrical box buried in my plaster wall.

The other was from my Dad's garage. My Dad's set is an artifact of an earlier age ('60s, probably), complete with a wooden case with recesses for each tap (and each die). The tap recesses have a hole at one end that's a little deeper than the rest of the recess. That's to allow you press that end of the tap down in order to tilt the other end up. Nice. It looks like my Dad might have used one size of tap: 3/8". The rest appear completely untouched.

Anyway, the all that "Whispering" made me curious. I recently reconfigured my dado jig to be width-adjustable. I used a pair of Rockler star knobs and some metal threaded inserts. It works fine, but what a pain it was to insert those ... inserts.

Yes, I know there's a tool, but I don't have it. I used a the widest slot screwdriver I have, but it still slipped out of the little grooves repeatedly, especially before the insert "bit" enough into the wood to keep itself upright.

On top of that, the knobs were a few bucks each. I got to thinking that - for jigs - I might try using machine bolts and tapped threads in wood. At least for jigs that would generally be set ONCE for a project.

I decided to do a test. I bought some 5/16" x 1.5" hex-head bolts. Even at the Home Depot "single unit" price they were only 20 cents each. I could make a lot of jigs for the price of a couple of plastic knobs.

I tried putting threads in Poplar, Oak and Birch Ply. I started out with the drill size that was listed on the inside lid of the lovely wooden case. That worked, and I couldn't pull the bolt out of the wood with a claw hammer, but the crests of the threads looked flat. I assume the recommendation was for tapping metal.

I reduced the hole size a 64th at a time until the threads looked sharp. That was at 13/64". I have to say, that bit, and the hole it produced, really looked too small for that tap, but it worked fine.

I wasn't particularly careful about tapping the holes. I used a drill to drive the tap, started off slow and progressed to a medium speed. It might have taken 15 seconds to tap each hole all the way through a 3/4" thickness.

The bolts fit well, with a small amount of wiggle. I decided to try one more test, which I only did with the Oak. I threaded the bolt into the hole, but left 1/4" of room at the bottom. I put the wood right over the leg of my workbench and hit the head of the bolt repeatedly with a hammer, hard. The bolt didn't move and the threads seemed undamaged.

I'm wondering if any of you ever find a use for tapped holes. If I were building a jig that I knew I'd use a lot, and would need repeated adjustments, I'd probably use the inserts. But this was quick, efficient and cheap. I think I may give it a try for some jigs I'll need to build soon.

Reply to
Greg Guarino
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I can't speak to tapping wood, but I can offer another technique for using bolts in wood with no fear of ever stripping the threads in the wood.

Assuming you have access to the back/underside of the wood, use a spade or forstner bit to make a recess slightly larger than a nut that will fit onto your bolt or threaded rod. Make the recess just a little bit deeper than t he nut, leaving as much wood between the nut side and the bolt side as poss ible.

Next, drill through the wood for your bolt. Coat the threads of the bolt wi th Vaseline, insert it through the wood and into the nut. Be sure to keep a ll Vaseline off of the outside of the nut.

Now fill the nut recess with epoxy, securing the nut into the wood. The bol t will keep the epoxy out of the nut and the Vaseline will prevent the epox y from adhering to the threads of the bolt so you'll be able to unscrew it after the epoxy cures.

We used to use this technique so that we could securely attach axle mounts and weight plates to the floorboards of Soap Box Derby cars. Instead of usi ng real nuts, I made my own nuts out of 1" lengths of 3/4" steel rod. With

30+ "nuts" made from steel rod, I was able to not only secure the parts tha t needed to be secured, but I was able to get extra weight down low where I wanted it. I bolted and unbolted objects (with torques of over 120 in-lbs) hundreds of times without a single issue.

You should scuff up the nuts so that the epoxy has something to key into fo r added strength.

Reply to
DerbyDad03

------------------------------------------------------ I have built several jigs using 1/4"-20, 5 point star knobs, 1/4" flat washers, 1/4"-20 hex heads bolts of required length for the individual jig.

A 1/4"-20 hex head is 7/16" across the flats, 9/16" across the points, as well as a flat washer that is also about 9/16".

You drill a 5/8" hole with a forstner bit, 1/2" deep, followed by a

9/32" dia hole of the req'd length to allow the star knob to be engaged.

Stick a bolt with a flat washer into the 5/8" hole and temporially snug up hand tight on the opposite end with another flat washer and a

1/4"-20 nut.

Mix up some epoxy thickened with micro-balloons and pour into 5/8" hole covering washer and hex head of bolt.

Wait a couple of days, remove hex hut with washer and you are good to go.

Have fun.

Lew

Reply to
Lew Hodgett

You might want to try the method shown in this video...

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Joe

Reply to
Just Another Joe

Don't use a screw diver, use a piece of threaded rod (or a bolt) with two nuts so you can jam them against the insert and use them with a wrench to turn in the insert.

Reply to
dadiOH

Yes. I've used various, from 8-32 to 1/2-13.

Cross grain, they work well in hardwood, never tried in soft wood. They can be improved by tapping, putting cyanoacrylate glue in the hole and re-tapping when it is dry.

With the grain, they work less well because the threads are cutting cross grain and are therefore weak and break easily. The glue really helps here, same with threads on dowels.

Reply to
dadiOH

"dadiOH" wrote in news:mfr5vm$4fq$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:

Yeah, this is the only way to insert the kind that have a "screwdriver slot". Using a longish rod (or bolt) also makes it easier to put them in straight.

There is a better kind of insert that has a hex recess for an allen wrench for installing it. Those are hard to find, but 1000% easier to use.

John

Reply to
John McCoy

I have done it in turned exotics but not for any of the relatively weak woods you quote. In various rosewoods and desert ironwood it is possible to tap very clean strong holes and the matching threads in ~1/4" sizes to fasten ornamental parts together. This was a very common practice in the 'olden days' when tiny parts were made of ivory and had to be fastened into wood in such a way that they could be removed or repaired. I've not had any ivory to try but it does work fine in solid bone parts.

Reply to
BenignBodger

John McCoy wrote in news:XnsA473651104057pogosupernews@213.239.209.88:

FWIW, the ones Lee Valley sells have the hex recess. Might be worth ordering a hundred next time they have free shipping.

Puckdropper

Reply to
Puckdropper

That slot is to cut threads into the wood. I just take a screw and put a nut on it, lock it down and drive it. Never use the brass slot to drive it.

I do this a lot. I recommend some butchers/johnsons wax on the tap. Just dip it in and it will lube the tap. Yes it helps.

Maple taps real nice. But most everything is tapable. Open pore is less desireable as they are rougher.

Reply to
woodchucker

"dadiOH" wrote in news:mfr6eq$664$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:

I'll second this. We used thin CA to reinforce the holes in balsa and plywood when I used to fly RC airplanes. The hole were amazingly durable. The key is to use the thin stuff so it soaks into the wood.

Reply to
Larry

It's unusual to use machine threads in wood, because (1) wood moves, and (2) a little corrosion, sap, wood movement, and age will lock the screw in just like glue. Looser thread fits are used, I believe, when wood is threaded, than for metal. Conventionally, tee nuts, barrel nuts, and other metal threaded inserts are employed, with oversize clearance holes in the wood, and it's always assumed that takeapart later will be easy.

Field-expedient tee nut substitute: a hexagonal mortise and a hex nut.

Experiment away, though: that's the best way to find new things out.

Reply to
whit3rd

Not really. I have quite a few that work fine. I have used both steel and nylon screws, never had either rip out. Know which wood to use.

Reply to
woodchucker

The slot is on the back end of the insert. How does it cut threads? I agree that using a flat-blade screwdriver isn't the best way to insert inserts. There are tools used to install these things, though I like the threaded rod idea (alignment).

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Reply to
krw

It's been years since I've seen the "screw-driver slot" type offered for sale around here. Virtually all in-hex or "allen" drive.

Reply to
clare

I'm chiming in a bit late on this thread, but I was just re-reading a FWW article (#126) on exactly this subject. The author found that the threads were a lot stronger than he thought they would be. A letter in the following issue pointed out the strength increased with the diameter of the bolt. So one could get approximately the same strength as a 1/4" bolt in a threaded insert by using a bolt with the same diameter as the insert.

I've made wooden bolts and wooden screws of 3/4" and 1" diameter for homemade vises and I've never managed to break the threads no matter how tight I crank them. I have popped and/or split the 3" diameter end holding the handle. but the threads were still good.

Reply to
Larry Blanchard

Yeah, I think the slot is for driving. If you needed to remove the insert it would be next to impossible to remove with out the slot being on the outer side when inserted.

Reply to
Leon

I use inserts and bolts all the time to attach upper cabinets to lower cabinets.

I in particular I use these which are relatively inexpensive, and can be easily driven with the power driver listed beside each insert size.

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Reply to
Leon

Actually,,,,

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Reply to
Leon

snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote in news:cn33iap67hel6vj4h5pdkqikod93q43r0l@

4ax.com:

Ah, but you're in Canada, right, where they have Robertson screws and all manner of other high-quality hardware.

The slotted kind are what's carried at Home Depot, Lowes, and such like places.

John

Reply to
John McCoy

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