Speaking Of Clamps - Jet Cabinet Set, $200?

Where do Jet clamps rank? This set is $260 on Amazon, $200 on my local Craigslist.
The blocks are shown in the CL listing, no mention of the bench dogs.
"Great shape, not all covered in glue"
(Amazon.com product link shortened)
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On 5/29/18 6:42 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

Still pricey, I'd wait for the eventual sale that comes along.
I own Bessys and these Jets. The Jets are "clunky" but have nice features. The only drawback I have noticed (after being mentioned in this group) is the jaws tend to mark softer woods when cranked down. The advantage I see over my Bessys is the ability to really crank down 8^)
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On 5/29/18 8:06 AM, Brewster wrote:

What he said. I think the deal that comes a couple times a year is around $189, new. I think I used the blocked once and never again. The dogs sit in may drawer because I don't have that kind of workbench.
And yes to the marking softer woods. Kind of pisses me off when it happens.
--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
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On 5/29/18 7:42 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

You might want to hit your local HD, first. I've heard good things about the Bessy K-Body REVOlution clamps. Two 50" and Two 24" would be $150.
--

-MIKE-

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On Tuesday, May 29, 2018 at 11:24:30 AM UTC-4, -MIKE- wrote:

$40 for the 50" Bessy clamps is a heck of a deal on a price-per-pound basis.
Those suckers are heavy!. ;-)
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wrote:

+1
I also like the Bessys because of the available accessories.
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On 5/29/2018 7:42 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

Jets are ok, You want to oil the screw PIVOT point where it meets the big washer end, not only the screw itself.
Also these type clamps normally do not need passing to prevent denting the wood. NOT THE CASE with Jet. Jet clamps imprent the work.
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On Tuesday, May 29, 2018 at 5:45:06 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:

Not that I'm planning on buying them, but what is different about the Jet clamps that they damage the wood?
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On 5/29/18 8:31 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

I'd be interested in knowing for sure but if I had to guess, I would say the plastic covering on the jaws is thinner on the Jets.
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On 5/29/2018 8:31 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

I am not sure, but there are straight line imprints on the wood at the edge of the clamp faces. It is probably the hard plastic that they use, it apparently stays flat. I would guess that the Cabinetmaster and Bessey clamps have a little give on the surface and they probably leave a less visible smoother arc shaped indention with out leaving a defined imprint.
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On 5/31/18 10:32 AM, Leon wrote:

If you look at the back side of the tail end jaw, you will see two flat sections of steel bar stock used, horizontally on the left and right sides of the jaw. These are covered in that plastic housing, which is the only thing on the flat/clamping section of the jaw that presses against the wood.
The handscrew end has a steel box-like structure, covered in the plastic housing, but there is steel across the section that presses against the wood.
The tail end jaw has the edges of the steel bar stock pushing against the plastic, and against the wood being clamped. Obviously, the hollow middle section has more give than the edge section which are backed by the steel. So the imprints you see are the edge sections where the steel is on the edges.
Very poor design, imo.
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-MIKE-

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On 5/31/2018 11:46 AM, -MIKE- wrote:

The beauty of the "K Body" and clone design clamps is that you do not have to use a cushion between the clamp surface and the work, except in this case with the Jet's. Yes, the Jet design team missed the point totally. I am certain they looked at the competition and designed their own version. BUT they did not actually do any field testing to compare results. I would bet that the testing and one box to check. Do they clamp, YES. Do the clamps damage the wood, not on the qualification check list.
I once bought a set of clones at a WW show and they were designed by that vendor that I bought them from. No one else sold this particular clamp. Great clamps, EXCEPT the plastic material used on the clamping surfaces OOZED oil and permanently stained the wood. I returned the clamps.
I feel that the Bessy clamps, kBody or revo, are built a little too tight. They can be crotchety to slide open or close. Also their screw travel is short. I find that once the clamp engages to actually start clamping you have used up more than half of the travel. If you use clamps a lot this becomes very irritating. A big issue when trying to close a mortise and tenon joint on each end of a rail.
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I generally use a finger to hold the bottom of the sliding wedge in the correct direction for it to catch immediately - only requires a couple turns of the handle to get it tight.
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On 5/31/2018 1:02 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:

I generally am using one hand to hold the clamp in place, the other to tighten the handle. ;~)
I am actually using Bessy Revo clamps so they may be different that the old style k Bodies. I can easily tilt the handle to get the wedge to engage but there is a lot of screwing after that before any pressure is applied.
Still their screw travel is short compared to Cabinet Masters. I never owned the old style Bessy k Bodies. If that is what you are using you are probably having better luck than I am with the Revo's.
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Yeah, I have a bunch of K-bodies.
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On Thursday, May 31, 2018 at 1:54:39 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:

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Do you guys use the KP blocks for stacking the clamps perpendicular to each other?
https://www.woodcraft.com/products/bessey-kp-blocks-set-of-4
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On 5/31/2018 9:39 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo. In fact they cost you depth. They are set up such that you put perpendicular clamp bars on top of each other. The clamp surface of the bottom clamps will be less equal to the thickness of the top clamp bars.
I always put two clamps on bottom and two clamps on top of the glue up.
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On Thursday, May 31, 2018 at 11:41:19 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:

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I'm not arguing, just trying to learn. Let's ignore the cost of the blocks for the purposes of this discussion.
Why does it matter if you lose depth on a glueup that still fits within the exposed area of the lower jaws? e.g. any work piece less than 2.5" thick.
A 3/4" cabinet door for example. As long as the jaws are parallel along their entire length, why does the work piece need to be buried deep into the clamp?
In fact, unless you raise the lower clamps (and therefore the work piece) off of the work surface, aren't you losing depth on the upper clamps when they are inverted as shown here?
https://i.imgur.com/HNQmFlL.jpg
Of course, raising the lower clamps off of your nice flat work surface could introduce twist, which we all know we don't want.
What am I missing?

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On 6/1/2018 6:45 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

Understood, not a problem. ;~)

In that case it would matter. BUT I build hundreds of drawers and the vast majority are way deeper than 2.5" thick. So a relative large amount of the joint does not see the face of the bottom clamp.
In fact a K-Body style clamp has its limitations too. I have worked around that issue. If I have a 5~7" deep drawer I put the clamp to the side of the drawer rather than on bottom and on top. The entire length of these style clamps, top above the bar, the area beside the bar, and the area under the bar are valid usable clamping surfaces. so I literally use the entire length of the whole clamp face rather than that surface just above the bar. I tilt the clamp in at the top.

In this case not an issue. BUT, did I tell you I build hundreds of drawers yet??? LOL.
You do not need 4 clamps on a door/drawer after the pressure has been applied. Two is plenty. In my case I put two clamps on bottom pressing the stiles against the rails. I put two clamps on top to ensure that the joints rails are not proud of the stile ends. Once every thing is lined up and tight I remove the top clamps and move the glued up assembly and the two bottom clamps out of the way.
The beauty of this method is that you can do twice as many glue ups with half as many clamps.

I do not see any clamp blocks.. ;~)

I do not have a twisting issue if the clamps are correctly positioned and tight.

The expense of using unnecessary clamps blocks.

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Here is an example of 4 walnut doors with only 8, vs. 16 clamps. Keep in mind that I started with 4 clamps during the glue up but removed the two clamps that were only helping to ensure that the rails did not protrude past the stiles.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/11889144346/in/dateposted-public/
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