I actually don't think it's a matter of whether or not they would deploy in
the bumping around on the racetrack. I believe it's more of a matter of it
not being necessary. With the use of the 5-point harness and head and neck
restraint, I suspect the addition of an air bag would add very little to
overall safety. By the way, head and neck restraint devices have been
mandatory since October 2001 in NASCAR, so I'd say they've "caught on"
pretty well. I've looked and can't find a race death in NASCAR since then.
I'm not saying it hasn't happened, but I can't seem to find it if it has.
HANS type devices have caught on very well. Dale Earnhardt didn't wear one
and neither did the other 42 drivers that day. Since his death though, they
have become mandatory. I'd say that's catching on pretty well. Shame they
had to become mandatory and under those circumstances, but at least everyone
is wearing them now.
I guess what I'm saying is that an airbag, while it could be engineered
to perform properly in a racecar, is a heavy complicated piece of
equipment, and I'm not sure it'd solve any problems that can't be solved
in less complicated, lighter ways.
How the heck did we get on this topic anyway?
That's pretty much what I've been saying but this fellow Upscale seems a bit
miffed that his idea couldn't get off the ground. God bless him for
thinking and even for thinking out of the box, or wierdly, since that's
where all truly good idead really come from, but he sure does seem sensative
if his ideas aren't embraced by one and all.
Ah-ha, it was just a matter of time before this question came up...
No, I'm not miffed in anyway, it's just that sometimes I get caught up in
the heat of the discussion. Obviously, I'm lacking a certain amount of
knowledge as to why an air bag wouldn't have some value in a race car, but
only because I'm a true believer that just because something hasn't been
done properly yet, doesn't mean that it's impossible.
I was the driver in an accident once that should have resulted in my death,
but I came away with a simple cut on my hand and that was it. When I show a
picture of the smashed vehicle to people, some refuse to believe that I was
in it during the crash. A seatbelt saved my life so I'm all for the
advancement of most all types of safety products for cars. But as many here
have told me, we're discussing racing vehicles, not family cars.
I meant only to point out the absurdity of his characterization of the
contact between NASCAR racers as "a little rubbing". Anyone who had ever
seen a NASCAR race, even once, would know that it's a *lot* more than
that. Which adds a little ironic humor to his characterization of the
rest of us as a bunch of armchair quarterbacks or whatever it was.
To which you replied:
"Of course you wouldn't want one going off just because of a little rubbing."
Perhaps not, but comments like that one certainly do.
Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter
by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com
You must use your REAL email address to get a response.
I seen you before - you're all over the internet and you're all over where
people are discussing things. You're the guy that takes a statement made by
a person and twists it so that you can force your own conclusion. Sorry,
but I never said danger was of no consideration in the sport. I simply
replied to your broad sweeping assertion that airbags would not be placed in
race cars because of the macho, danger image that is so important to the
racing industry. I challenged that assertion, demonstrated the outright
lunacy of that statement and challenged your very knowledge of the sport you
feel so free to speak about. You need to go back and read the thread again.
Don't bother me again until you can employ intellectual honesty in a
discussion. Those who argue like you argue simply for the sake of the
argument and I don't have any interest in that.
No - read what I wrote again - airbags would bring nothing to the sport.
Kindly explain what purpose they would serve that is not already served by
the 5 point harness. An airbag is a restraint device. What more restraint
is needed in a race car? Now, if you had asserted that they provide a
better degree of g-force management than a 5 point harness, I would agree to
a point, but you didn't. There - I made your argument for you. The counter
point to that however would be that other technologies such as crumple zones
and controlled releases of energy are likely to be better alternatives than
the airbag. I'm not saying airbags will never appear in race cars, but I am
saying that right now they offer nothing that existing technologies do
already. No benefit, no point in making the investment.
Uh, the folks who control organized automobile racing are _very_ safety
conscious. That's why the Mille Miglia is no longer run, it's why the
Monza oval with the famed Wall is no longer used, it's why many tracks have
had multiple chicanes added, it's why nearly if not all organizations
require self-sealing fuel cells, and on and on.
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
race car seat belts are the most expensive, best engineered sealtbelts
around, and all of the extra weight of those roll cages can't be
helping their lap times any. considering that some of those cars cost
upwards of a million bux, the cost of air bags, even custom made ones,
is nothing. hell, part of the machismo of race cars is the "mine cost
more than yours did" bit.
on the race track with all of the jostling for position and stiff
suspensions and whatnot the opportunities for false deployments is
much higher than for the highway. at 200MPH the result is certain to
involve the loss of control of a race car, generally in the middle of
a pack of other race cars. I'd guess airbags in race cars would cause
more accidents than they would be worth, IN THAT ENVIRONMENT.
for that matter, seatbelts DO present a choking hazard. I don't know
how much of one, but it is not zero, probably highest for kids and
very short people. however, they present a net gain in safety for
One of the reasons for the adjustable height types. And child seats.
Standard seatbelt injuries are clavicles (collarbones) and for those wearing
them high on their bellies, against advice, possible spleen. Other than
Seems the only thing that works as advertised, even when you do nothing
right, is that airbag.
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