Lowes

[Tom Watson]

I deal with at least a couple of suppliers who won't even sell to non-professionals. My hardwood supplier has a two hundred board foot minimum if I pick up and a five hundred board foot minimum delivered. I can buy for about one fourth to one third of what it costs at a lumber yard, because the yards buy from this guy.

My sheet goods supplier will only sell to the trade and sends out a salesman on the initial call to verify that you have working shop. The discount is not as big as it is in solid stock but I have access to products that simply are not available through yards. ie real cabinet grade plywood, sequence matched and numbered.

When I bought from Sherwin Williams, I ran about twenty percent lower than what Joe Homeowner could get the goods for.

My hardware supplier sells only to the trade and I can get solid brass knobs, 1 1/2" for less than a dollar apiece when I buy a hundred. I get Grass 180 degree hinges for about a dollar and a half each.

Being in business demands that you work your way upstream. You have to find out who the supplier is for your current supplier and see if that guy will do business with you directly.

It is amazing what paying cash upfront can do to open some of these doors.

Regards, Tom. Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker Gulph Mills, Pennsylvania

[Brian Henderson]

Mostly because you don't buy in the same volume as most contractors. The more you buy, the more you save, that's the way it works in most retail outlets. Contractors usually get special prices because they purchase wood and supplies for entire houses at a time, usually many times a month. You simply can't match that kind of buying power and Lowes or HD doesn't chase your business and give you special rates because of it.

[Brian Henderson]

That's pretty stupid, you'd be boycotting every home center on the planet because they *ALL* do the same thing.

[Brian Henderson]

All places are open to the general public. Heck, when I used to work for 84 Lumber, which is primarily for contractors, we had plenty of DIYers coming in all the time. But it was the contractors who would put $200k on their credit accounts at a crack and get the best prices.

If you can't afford to spend what they spend, don't complain that you're not getting the prices they get.

[Charlie Self]

Yup. For good reason, cabinetmaker's supply companies do NOT want to deal with Joe & Jane Average (obvious reasons being the lack of volume, having to handle a piece too many times, etc.).

As a woodworker, I've been lucky enough to have cabinetmaker friends willing to add my order to their order for a slight premium over what they pay. Some will. Some won't. It is not something to base a friendship on, but may develop from a friendship over time.

That 200 bf minimum can be a killer if you don't have an near immediate need for that much and don't have storage space, a common complaint among hobby woodworkers. Thus, hobbyists end up paying 6 or 8 bucks a bf for semi-decent red oak at Lowe's or HD or a similar chain.

I really cheat. I go around to small local lumberyards and find out what hardwoods they've overcut recently. Take it home (not here in Parkersburg, where I've got zip for storage or shop space). Stack & sticker & wait. Skip plane at 6 months. Joint & one side plane after maybe 9-10 months, depending on my need for the wood.

Finish indoors, in the shop.

Cost for the raw, green wood is usually around half a buck a board foot. Finished out, it probably costs $1.50 for oak or cherry for the FAS stock and maybe a buck for the log run.

Charlie Self

"The income tax has made liars out of more Americans than golf." Will Rogers

[Edwin Pawlowski]

The other consideration with discounts is the time involved. The pro knows what he wants, places the order, loads, and is gone in a short time. Joe Homeowner often has no clue, takes twice the time of the sales person and the guys in the shop for a sale that is about 5% of the pro shop.

Where I work we discourage small pickups by customers. My crew can load a

53" trailer with a particular item in about 30 to 40 minutes with 2 people. It consists of 26 large units. We have one customer that comes with his own inadequate truck and picks up two of them himself. It takes the same amount of time to get him loaded and tied down. Same amount of paperwork to bill him $200 at it is to bill the big customer $5000. Ed

[Tom Watson]

I'd like t be able to go that way but it takes a tremendous amount of space and time. I buy mostly FAS and #1 Common stock. I buy it in quantities suited to the jobs in the pipeline and many times I make up the difference in the five hundred foot minimum for delivery by filling out the rest with poplar, which is cheap and is used up quickly in millwork and secondary wood usage.

I've bought from small local mills in the past and found that the run of the mill has too low a proportion of cabinet grade face wood to be economical. You may only pay a small amount per board foot but that price goes up when you consider culls and below grade slabs.

I pay about four bucks for cherry but ninety percent of it is useful. I pay about a buck and a half for poplar and damned near all of it is useful.

When I deal with an expensive wood like cherry or walnut, it is sometimes worth it to buy less than FAS and deal with the time involved in cutting out the defects. This is mostly true in library jobs where I might have use for small widths of pilasters and edge materials. When I have a dining room table job it means that I have to go to the yard and select and this drives the price up by a great amount.

I hope that in your upcoming book you explain the ins and outs of hardwood grading, particularly in the case of walnut, which has rules unlike any other domestic hardwood. The grading standards are so various and flexible as to be nearly incomprehensible to someone who has not been involved with it on a professional level for some time.

When I started out, I got pissed off that so much of the wood sent to me was unusable. My waste factors, bids and profitability have gone up since then.

Regards, Tom. Thomas J. Watson-Cabinetmaker Gulph Mills, Pennsylvania

[Jay Windley]

I'm sure I'll run into that if I escalate my appetite for projects. I haven't had any yet refuse me service because I'm not a professional, but I've been put off myself by minimums I wasn't prepapred to satisfy. Maybe that was their polite way of saying they didn't want my business, but I'm usually the one who brings up the minimum.

I have some pipe organ builders who let me piggyback on their orders too; it's just more convenient for me. It's not because I can't get materials any other way.

It's fine with me if a supplier wants to decide who his customers should be.

[B a r r y B u r k e J r .]

Hire me, I can load a 53" trailer in 3-4 minutes.

Barry

[Gfretwell]

One has to remember that it is the contractor, buying widgets a pallet at a time that allows the Borg to sell them one at a time, cheaper than you can get at the counter store. Borgs are putting the smaller counter operations out of business around here. I went to a medium sized electrical supplier the other day looking for stailess outlet plates, no joy. Home Depot had them ... cheaper than I could get them from Greybar.

[Bruce]

Not just around there, around America. We are reaching the pinnacle of capitalism. In a decade or so, there will exist:

1. Walmart
2. Borg or Lowes
3. Microsoft

The only place where more than one will survive is where variety is demanded by the public such as food, cars, etc. Even those are consolidating down to a select few restaurants and car makers.

[Henry St.Pierre]

It depends on what you are buying. The Borgs usually have better prices on tools than the industrial/commercial suppliers I buy from. I'm referring to circular saws, drills, routers etc. Perhaps if I was buying

12 saws etc. this wouldn't be true. I also buy most of my PT lumber there (the framing stuff that is usually covered or hidden from view), drywall, sheet goods, insulation, screws and nails. I never buy finishing supplies or any appearance grade lumber there. Most of the time I buy there for convenience. At the volume I purchase supplies, my discounts are minimal. Hank

[Leslie Gossett]

Don't you know sarcasm when you hear it. Don't call me stupid until you have met me.

[Leslie Gossett]

P.S.

The borgs near me may have special pricing and sales for contractors, I doubut it. They don't display them where the general public can see and complain about them.

[Leslie Gossett]

P.S.

The borgs near me may have special pricing and sales for contractors, I doubt it. They don't display them where the general public can see and complain about them.