I have a new set of Marples blue-chip chisels that is flat across the chisel face (as much as I can tell), but is slightly convex along its length, maybe about 1mm out at the end if I lay a ruler flat at the base of the face.
Is this slight convexity normal, or should I return the set? I am aware I have to "flatten" the face before honing, but with a slight round along the length, getting a straight cut by, for example, lining up a chisel against a block of wood clamped to your workpiece is made more difficult. Most discussions on flattening the face discuss the area right at and behind the bevel.
the tide seems to be turning against Marples lately. did I lead the charge? :)
(In my humble, highly unqualified, seldom respected newbie opinion, the Marples are tres substandard, due to the softness of the metal they are currently using; just like the Buck I tried for grins.)
Give me a call and come over and you can try my Marples, Bucks, Two Cherries a couple of Robert Sorby firmers a couple of Japanese bench chisels AND you can wack the living CR*P out of one or more Mr. Wilson's beefy mortise chisels
You're bound to find that one of them will live up to your expectations.
I'll take you up on that, Charlie. I've been super busy lately; the only time spent in my shop lately has been to clean it up. I still would like to try your shoulder plane, too. I'll bring a couple of the Sears chisels so you can give 'em the once over.
I still have your phone number (surprise) after my hard drive crash. I'll give you a call next week, at the latest.
These chisels will be all but impossible to flatten properly. If they were slightly concave across the chisel width they'd okay, but convex down it's length is not good. If you decided to use them anyway they'd be impossible to use well in most chiseling operations where a flat back is necessary for a straight cut.
Well, just last week I chopped a dozen mortises (1/2" wide x 1" deep by 1-1/4" long) with one of my "substandard" Marples mortising chisels (the ugly plastic yellow-handled ones that Garrett Wade used to sell as a set). Didn't even have to hone the blade.
Then I used my 1" Blue Chip to do the final cleanup on the matching tenons. Yeah, it was only paring, but it performed exactly as expected.
I reckon I've chopped 50-60 sets of dovetails with my Blue Chips since I got them in late 1997. And guess what? I haven't had an edge fold yet, and the only time I chipped an edge was when I tried to use a
1/8" chisel in cocobolo.
I've chopped a hundred or so mortises of various sizes with the mortise chisels. And guess what? Not a single folded or chipped edge.
Of course, I guess I'm one of those wreck idiots, so what do I know?
Chuck Vance Just say (tmPL) I'll see your anecdotal experience and raise it.
no, you are just an asshole who can't figure out that Marples now suck. (An asshole for the tone of your reply; not for your reluctance to recognize that many people here share the same low opinion of Marples as I do. Bet you skipped those posts from approximately 10 other folks over several threads, since I first posted my experience with Marples. Or you just discounted their opinions as you did mine, you egotistical prick.)
Thanks, Dave. I couldn't have asked for a better response from you. First you call people idiots for daring to have a different experience than yours. Then you try to take credit for changing others' opinions. Now you up the ante and call me an asshole and a prick (egotistical, no less ... pot meet kettle) for daring to have a different experience than yours.
maybe you should re-read YOUR previous super rude, egotistical comments. I only responded at your level. except for the name calling. Your attitude towards my recounting the facts of current Marples quality has been persistently RUDE.
And you still haven't responded to the fact that many others share my opinion.
Judging from your comments about "a better response", your sole purpose in posting your earlier comments were to piss me off, rather than to have a polite discourse on the topic of chisels. You reap what you sow.
Welcome to the FIRST spot on my NEW twit list. My hard drive crashed recently. I hadn't seen anything here to complain about in the past week, running without filters, but then again there were only a few guys on the list, besides all the filters for obscenities.
anything further you write will be for the consumption of your cronies. Talk to the hand!
Dave, you're applying a personal experience of yours inappropriately, and reaching a faulty conclusion. Marples don't "now suck."
Think of it like a car. If you bought a lemon, would you then conclude that the maker "now" produces nothing but junk? Of course not. Your one personal experience isn't a reasonable measure of the maker's entire product line.
I believe Chuck was trying to point this out to you -- that's why he included his yellow-handled Marples mortise chisel with his Blue Chips in his defense.
The truth of the matter is this: Various chisels having different levels of quality have been marketed under the Marples brand. (The same thing happens in virtually every large tool maker, including Stanley, and even
-- hold on to your seat! -- Veritas and Starrett.) It's because the large producer must heed the market. The chisels you purchased are substandard (apparently -- I'm trusting your opinion on this). That's about all you can say.
In reality, the Blue Chips are a medium grade that will perform quite well for the average woodworker in ordinary use. Being a medium grade, some particular examples naturally will be substandard; some will be very good. The occasional blade will be excellent.
In general, they (the Blue Chips) are OK. The best woodworkers recognize them for what they are, use them appropriately at tasks for which they are suited, making sensible and reasonable adjustments to the edge and their technique so that the tools will work well enough to produce excellent work. They will not look back. They do this with virtually all their tools.
Many average woodworkers will find them satisfactory out of the wrapper and would give them no second thought, except to wonder what all the fuss is about. Finicky yuppie newbies with more money than need for the tool, and who "always buy only the best" will complain that the tool is junk, return it or throw it away, and buy a German or Japanese import of equal or slightly better average quality, while sniffing their superiority at the "lesser" mavens of the wreck who would defend a tool that does the job only adequately.
I would hazard a guess that you made this claim rather foolishly, having no knowledge -- nor even evidence -- to back it up. You're free to retract it.
Now YOUR response is the one that Chuck the attacker should have presented. You are correct that my chisel experience with Marples was limited, BUT if you go through the archives (don't bother) you'll see quite a few others to agree with my assessment of Marples quality.
No knowledge of WHAT, specifically? The edge crumpled after a few moments use. My other chisels don't do that! I've got 15 other chisels, all of which I can rely on.
I'm waiting for you to post his reply. I've got him filtered, so can't read it without your repost, and won't change that, but I'm almost willing to bet...no, let's see what he says.
Charlie Self "Adam and Eve had many advantages but the principal one was that they escaped teething." Mark Twain
Thank you, Jim. That was exactly my point. I'm afraid that Dave long ago stopped reading for content in my posts and simply is looking for excuses to namecall. And frankly, I'm guilty of goading him on.
It's a fault of mine, and I'm trying to deal with it. :-)
Yes, and on some of the other threads relating to this, it does seem that there is a legitimate concern that since Marples was bought out by Rubbermaid, there may be more issues with QC. Time will tell.
Exactly. And my own experience has been more towards the good side.
And this was another point I was trying to convey earlier in a similar thread. You have to understand the limitations of the tool. I vary bevel angles depending on what I use a chisel for, and I adjust factory bevels on almost every single chisel I get. I even do that with mortise chisels; I raised a largish secondary bevel (actually looks more like a "hump" on the bevel) to give it a steeper angle which I've found holds up better under the abuse a mortise chisel is subjected to.
Thanks for being the voice of reason here, Jim. I know Dave has already (supposedly) dumped me into his killfile, so he may not see my response, but I hope he takes heed of all your comments.
tell charlie for me he's #2 on my recently reconstituted twit list, ok? thanks!
But unlike HIS request to see quotes of filtered posters, I prefer you leave him hidden to me. I've gotten my quota of aggravation from him for a life time.
Wow, thanks Dave. Charlie has more woodworking knowledge (and common sense) in his little finger than you could ever hope to get in your whole lifetime.
To be included in his company is high praise, indeed.
So what are you gonna do when your killfilter is complete and it's just you talking to yourself?
Chuck Vance Just say (tmPL) Oh, that's right ... you can't see this.
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