How do you that it's from the heater and not the LED mains indicator or teh fan. Of the LEDs on my washing machine flashing.
rubbish. Howq does a toilet light have differnt characteristics. ?
so how can you tell one from the other, you can't without some serious kit measuring it at source.
You can't isolate them that's the problem.
So show me the results...... Backlight currents have reduced by about 50% in the last 2 years so all your reesults will be worng anyway.
and what do yuo think the backlight is doing then.
so what is this current ?
what is this change ?
isn't what ?
it doesn't have to, donl;t forget you're only sampling what curretn the meter is reading in a fraction of a second.
In message , at
04:28:26 on Tue, 17 Mar 2015, whisky-dave remarked:Working harder when the scene being shown was shot at night, less hard when there's lots of white in it.
Driving the backlight.
and what exactly happens when the screen works 'harder' ?
Yes I want to know what magnitude this current is or what value it is. without knowing this you won't get anywhere.
so what current does a backlight use in a TV .
In message , at
06:38:05 on Tue, 17 Mar 2015, whisky-dave remarked:
The backlight gets brighter and as a result they can claim a better dynamic contrast ratio because scenes which would otherwise look like a sea of mud have some detail visible in them.
I posted some numbers a few days ago, measured from my clamp-on device at the electricity meter (which transmits the result every 4 second to a little box I have on my desk). Somewhere in the range 30-40 watts out of about 100 for the TV as a whole.
Smart meters don't provide samples of the current consumption of the house, they integrate the total current consumption and report that at a few instances a day.
and
From the size of the jump in current.
Ditto.
Its on for much shorter times more frequently than the other lights. The only lights that come close are lights inside cupboards and those don't aren't going to be the one that comes on every morning in winter as people get up and have their first piss or come on during the night as people piss.
It doesn't have to be done at the source, it can be seen in the total house current, just because that is varying much more frequently than with the on/off devices like lights and toasters etc.
Of course you can isolate them in the total house consumption.
But maybe you actually mean that with a smart meter you don't actually have say the total house current every 4 seconds, you actually have the total current integrated and reported back at a rate that is nothing like every 4 seconds. Its certainly true that with that it isn't even going to be easy to say work out exactly which light has been turned on. Tho it will certainly be possible to work out when at least one person has got up in the morning because that is when the total house current starts to increase from the minimum that is seen thru the night with an occasional spike as someone gets up for a piss etc.
On further thought, I'm not now convinced that will even be possible to work out what is being watched on a TV that does modulate the backlight as the program content changes, because all you have is the total house current integrated, you don't have 4 second samples of the house current. You do with the consumer addon meters that Roland has, but the smart meters used to charge you for the power you have used don't do it like that because there is no point in sampling every 4 secs with those, and there is no way to get that data out of the house anyway, so they don't bother to collect it like that.
I don't have a TV that varies the backlight with what's show on the screen. My TV is a gigantic glass tube TV than hasn't even been turned on for maybe 8 years now. I don't watch any TV live, I watch what the PVR records on one of the 24" wide screen LED monitors on the desktop which does everything, including being the PVR.
What ? All that matters is that they vary with what is on the screen.
It doesn't vary at anything like that rate because what is on the screen doesn't vary at anything like that rate.
Varies with the design of the TV obviously.
Isn't a step change.
That isn't how the electricity supply authority smart meters work.
They integrate the current over time because that is what you pay for.
The TV takes more current, to make the backlight brighter.
You can see that the maximum and minimum current is.
Varies with the design of the TV.
Its the opposite, its brighter when the scene is bright.
>
They integrate the energy used over time because that is what you are charged for. That changes depending on the voltage on the supply which changes with demand and with things like solar flux acting on solar panels nearby and on wind, etc.
In message , at 05:33:55 on Wed, 18 Mar 2015, john james remarked:
You do, because you are monitoring all the channels.
The analogy is the other way round, if you can monitor the TVs, you can also monitor the fridge/freezer.
In message , at 05:36:18 on Wed, 18 Mar 2015, john james remarked:
To do that they need to take lots of readings - rather than classic analogue meters which inherently do the integration.
How often they send those individual readings back to base will depend on how much they need to know.
These metering schemes are advertised as capable of telling the householder how much power each of his appliances takes - so that the householder can make decisions about buying more economical examples of each one, or perhaps arrange that they are only powered-up off-peak. If the local meter is doing that - they can send the answers back to base too.
But you don't get the total house consumption at anything like that sort of sampling rate. You ONLY get the integrated power and that is only sent out from the smart meter at a MUCH lower rate and so can never be used to even allow you to work out what is being watched on a single TV.
Yes, that can certainly be monitored.
Yes, but those readings never leave the smart meter.
But it is never going to be feasible to send say the integral every 4 seconds, there is nowhere near the comms bandwidth available to do that.
Yes, but that data doesn't need to leave the house.
If
But not anything like the data rate necessary to allow a central system to compare the waveform with what you get when you compare it with the screen intensity and contrast levels with TV program content even with one TV, let alone more than one.
In message , at 07:39:12 on Wed, 18 Mar 2015, john james remarked:
How does that work if the readings are integrated over time?
You can see the power per time period change.
In message , at 08:22:39 on Wed, 18 Mar 2015, john james remarked:
What is the time period.
In message , at 07:44:36 on Wed, 18 Mar 2015, john james remarked:
Today.
Today.
So you agree the meter can work out which appliances are drawing what, including two different TVs?
See my previous comments about the reverse-analogy you are pointedly ignoring.
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