Hi,
Any self employed carpenters here who are contracted to a larger company? I' ve always been employed "on the books" but been offered a new job as self-employed for better money.
Could anyone point out the nasty (like no notice period / no paid holidays) and the good (I don't know anything to put here :0( ).
The new position is work about 90 quid more a week but is self employed bad?
Any advice would be. well just dandy.
thanks
You'll perhaps find more pro carpenters over at the appropriate section on the Screwfix forums
Alex
The good and bad will be much the same for any self employed profession. On the plus side you have:
more freedom as to the type of work you do, and when / where potential to earn greater income opportunity to subcontract work to others (take on bigger jobs etc). Hence you can build a business and a brand if you want.
On the down side you have no employment rights or benefits and a little less security (although that only comes down to money in the bank in the end!). You will need to cover all aspects of running a business including sales and admin (i.e. paperwork). Having a good accountant is a must. You will need to provide your own tools, insurance, pension etc.
Much of the choice will come down to you attitude to these things. You also need to remember that there may be times when there is not enough work and hence you need to save money to allow for these.
You also need to be wary of the "clients" who really want an employee that they can exert a good degree of control over, but at the same time want the freedom from employment legislation that goes with contracting someone self employed. Hence you can end up with the worst of both worlds!
So in summary this should not be a decesion that you make lightly, but one that you give a good deal of consideration to. I would not have thought on the face of it, that an additional 90 / week would be enough incentive on its own. Howerver only you can decide what direction will better suit you and there may be other factors that are more important to you.
If you're being offered a job as 'self employed', you're still entitled to sick and holiday pay.
surely the new pay will be whatever you manage to negotiate on a case by case basis. And the employment will be as and when something is available.
Much of the rest of the reply is pretty obvious. Have a good work ethic not cutting too many corners. Go home proud of your work but finished with it for the day when you go off site, same as before.
Don't work more than two weeks for someone who hasn't paid you.
Find out about agencies and which ones are the best, where they have most work and that sort of thing.
Decide how far you are going to travel and stick to it in times of plenty.
Don't let someone with cash flow problems cut your wages by messing you around if you are on a price.
Keep asking around even when you are busy. Always expect to be the first to have to find something else.
Don't take on too many small jobs on the side.
Be prepared to have tools stolen, stock up with spares.
Don't get caught drunk driving or even somewhat inebreinated in charge of a vehicle. Drive carefully.
Don't let your bank account go below a realistic limit.
Don't work with thieves.
Keep your mouth shut until you know best. If you have to ask about the job, ask the foreman.
If you have to ask about money and such, do it quietly. Don't rely on anybody. (By which I mean; rely on a concensus of the best you have.)
I don't think so.
Oh yes you are. If you work for the same firm or employer other than on a genuinely casual basis - ie the odd day here and there - you're entitled to the same benefits as 'staff'. This could even include profit sharing etc if this is in force.
Holiday pay certainly, not so sure about sick.
If you work for the same firm all the time your not actually self employed.
If you are defined as a "worker" you get holiday pay these days. Be aware that many companies don't know this or if they do try and say that the holiday pay element is included in the rate but the rate hasn't changed since the law did...
Depends on how reliant you are on a regular pay cheque each month. Can you drum up other work to keep the cash flowing?
Fairly sure this self employment/freelance tpoic has been dicussed fairly recently in here try a google in the last 6 to 12 months. There are many implications and knock ons that need to be taken into account when becoming self employed.
If the self employed rate is not at least 15% higher than the employed rate then you'll probably end up with less money in your back pocket.
Not strictly true, you have may have less rights but a lot will be down to the contract you sign. Read it, slowly and carefully there are some very sharp employers out there...
But hasn't IR35 IIRC put paid to this caper?....
In article , Number 5 writes
If you can cope with being your own boss and all of the downsides listed by other contributors then go for it. But if you're going to do it the only way you will do it is in yourself. Them that do work for themselves them that don't know how to do it work for others..
If you get my drift..
Tell you what 'tho, of the some 50 odd of other "firms" we do some work for, I don't know "Anyone" of 50 years plus who does not want to take early retirement and get out it all.
As for me at 53 ,I still work a 7 day week and wish that there were more hours in the day:)) Which must prove "something"?.
Perhaps nothing quite like being in charge of yourself???....
ROFLMAO!
what rights would those be then...
IR35 has nothing to do with self employment or operating as a sole trader (i.e. schedule D). It only kicks in when a "worker" is being supplied by an "intermediary" (i.e. typically his own limited company).
When the gov originally "sold" the concept of IR35, they pitched it as some form or "worker protection" type of legislation rather than just a tax grab - pointing to unscrupulous employers sacking a worker, but then getting said worker to incorporate, and then immediately re employing them on a contractual basis. Hence side stepping many of their responsibilities to said worker for employment rights. The reality once implemented (as with so many bits of government legislation) was to not prevent the above at all, and in many ways achieve encourage it! Since IR35 pushes all of the responsibility for any additional taxation etc. directly onto the worker, it gives the "employer" incentive to do just that.
I think you are thinking of working as a "temp" which is yet another class of worker.
If you are genuinely self employed, then I can't see how a client can be responsible for sick or holiday pay. (You may still be able to claim Statuatary Sick Pay however).
If you are a self-employed contractor - which is what the OP proposes to be - you are entitled only to what you negotiate with the company to whom you contract. You have no statutuary employment rights, and you cannot be 'employed' on a self-employed basis. I speak as someone who worked as a self-employed contractor for many years. Also the OP will need to register with the Inland Revenue and get himself a CIS card - the IR are fairly strict about the issue of self-employed, you cannot simply declare yourself such and carry on working for the company with whom you have worked on a PAYE basis.
Absolutely. And that sounds exactly what the OP has been offered - a full time job as 'self employed'.
In article , Dave Plowman (News) writes
Humm... The revenue don't like that:((
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