Part P conudrum.....

[John Cartmell]

So you support bear-baiting, c*ck-fighting, and slavery then ...?

BTW - you're misleading yourself. Centuries? Fox-hunting? No.

[Andy Hall]

Not particularly. I just don't support inappropriate use of legislation for political ends.

The ID card thing is another example of that game.

Unnecessary and unwanted interference in people's lives.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Then bring back c*ck fighting bull baiting dog fighting etc etc. Doesn't effect the average man.

[Doctor Drivel]

Neither do we.

[John Cartmell]

All legislation is political so we're stuck on the word 'inappropriate'. I call it appropriate but long overdue. It was delayed because vested interests managed to keep up their activities long after related immoral practices were made illegal. We're back in the extrapolation business again - but your argument would equally match any animal welfare legislation, banning slavery & the slave trade, parliamentary reform, banning the employment of 8 year olds in mines, &c. It makes one wonder what sort of activities you might approve of.

That's probably what paedophiles think about their activities being subject to 'political' legislation.

[Joe]

I said nothing about cruelty or harm to people or animals. I said 'disapprove'. DD didn't mention cruelty or harm, either, justifying the fox-hunting ban by invoking the disapproval of the majority, as if that was a sufficient argument. *That's* what I'm taking exception to.

It would be hard to find a single human activity which wasn't disapproved of by someone, and I think we are all aware of the sheep-encouraging abilities of the mass media. One might suspect, veering vaguely back towards topic, that 'the majority' of the British public might disapprove of DIY electrical work, especially if so encouraged. Is that sufficient grounds to ban it (totally)? Or would facts and rational argument be a desirable part of the legislative process?

[Doctor Drivel]

So you obviously don't like democracy. There are various tyrannical regimes around the world which you may find more appealing.

[Joe]

Democracy is prone to several serious illnesses. Unfortunately, we haven't yet found anything better.

'Tyranny of the majority' (Google if you've never heard the term) is one of the sicknesses of democracy, and can be terminal. Failure to tolerate minorities leads to the Indian approach to democracy, which involves a considerable amount of assassination.

I don't have a simple answer to the problems of human government, I'm just pointing out that the Tyranny of the Majority, if not discouraged, eventually makes democracy unworkable. By all means, applaud TotM if you're not keen on democracy.

[Andy Hall]

I'm not stuck on it at all. It's unnecessary and inappropriate and that's that.

From what I hear today, there is just as much hunting going on as there was a year ago. The police have limited powers and little interest in doing anything about it because of the hopeless drafting of the legislation. The government couldn't even manage to create effective legislation. Given that situation, they have wasted huge amounts of money and valuable parliamentary time on something that in the overall scheme of priorities is not that important.

We're not in extrapolation at all. The point was about hunting legislation and it was against the original background of other worthless legislation like part P of the Building Regulations. Both are and have been shown to be pointless.

That certainly is extrapolation and a weak way to justify something that is as inherently as pointless and broken as the government who enacted it.

[Andy Hall]

The point really is that if there is going to be legislation, at least do it properly.

The problem for the government is that to do so would require quite draconian measures and huge costs. They have enacted a window dressing type of legislation. Slightly more people are not in favour of fox hunting as are for it (or more specifically not in favour of legislating against it).

If the supplementary question were asked as to how much resource they wanted to be spent on it at the expense of things like petty theft and graffiti on walls and they were asked to choose; I am pretty sure that the numbers who care about the hunting issue at the expense of things that immediately affect them would be quite a lot less.

[Doctor Drivel]

You are.

If they kill animals I would jail the lot of them. Barbarians.

We are.

It is.

[Doctor Drivel]

How else do you say, "you don't kill animals for fun"?

[Capitol]

IMM is a vegetarian immigrant then?

Regards Capitol

[Capitol]

The rest of the world does, why do you think that we are different?

Regards Capitol

[Doctor Drivel]

I see no relevance to immigrant.

[Doctor Drivel]

Do they? They chop heads off in public in Saudi Arabia, so maybe we should do that as well.

[Dave]

I would make this the first priority of anyone posting drivel :-)

Dave

[Capitol]

Nah. Too messy. Stick to hanging. Public possibly. Maybe we can sell it to tv as a franchise. Gives Gordon some more tax revenue to waste.

Regards Capitol

[Doctor Drivel]

I hope Gordon taxes the hell out of you.

[John Rumm]

All the more for your benefits cheque heh?