Not using the NHS app

No different to a paper version. Don't think you even have to put a time on those just name and contact details, so according to the paper version you've been in the pub, or multiple pubs, all day... B-)

Also this is used to send a general "your phone was in a hotspot venue, get tested if symptoms appear" alert not a "your phone was been near a positive case for rather too long, isolate and get a test". Curiously if you do get a test and it's negative you still must isolate for the 14 days. Seems little point in *going out* to get a test if a negative result doesn't cut short the isolation, say, after a second negative test, 5 days after the first, to give time for the virus to multiply if the first test date was too close to the exposure date.

The "isolate, get a test alert " comes from the Bluetooth proximity data using a points based system, which for the trial was:

More than 900 pts from the same phone in a day generates the alert. I would hope "day" is a 24 hour rolling period rather than midnight to midnight for example. Also don't know what happens after the 5 min timeout. I would hope the timeout resets and starts counting again. So >15 mins non-stop at 0 - 2 m, or > 30 mins non-stop at 2 - 4 m triggers the alert.

I noticed when passing my local at lunchtime on a fine day recently that the forecourt which has those wooden tables with bench seats was jam packed with people - mainly youngsters - both seated and standing. I'm told the inside is controlled as regards social distancing.

Ah right. If something can be made to only partially work as intended, far better not to have it at all. 100% or nothing in your world?

You really really really do need to get out more.

What you are actually saying is a rich patient has the choice. That is no different from the UK, where private medical care is readily available.

But being a good Tory, you want to remove adequate care from those who aren't rich. As a principle.

GPs have never been NHS staff. Same with high street dentists and opticians.

They are more private sub contractors to the NHS - but can have private patients too.

Are you saying you have had treatment at a hospital where they didn't have your NHS number?

The one exception may be visitors to in patients.

Ah - right. So as well as the health people making a profit you add in an insurance company one too? And make that insurance compulsory?

Have you asked employers in the UK what they think of that idea? Being a good Tory who presumably supports UK businesses?

In message snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk>, at 12:05:25 on Sun, 4 Oct

Why is the hospital treating visitors?

They are self-employed actually, but the NHS provides a 'fee' for every patienmt on their books, and then there are a host of activities where they earn extra brownie points (money). Plus they can charge what they like for things that the NHS doesn't do, like write letters to the local planning authority confirming that Patient X suffers from asthma so his requrst to cut down birch trees in a conservation area is 'valid' (yes really, we one local planning application for jus this). Meanwhile if you actually *need* to see a GP, forget it.

However even though they are 'self employed' with many ways to boost their practice income (one east London GP got his income up to £340,000/year), they are full members of the NHS superannuation scheme!

So what is different to an inefficient tax collecting organisation collecting NI and then a treasury department spending some of it to pass on to regional bodies who spend part of it before passing it on to the working face of the health business?

They already pay their contribution of NI. Or do you think the NHS money comes from the magic money tree?

Funny isn't it. Clowns like Our Dave seem content with the profit motive for all other aspects of their life, such as food, clothing, cars, their TV, aircraft, holidays, the list is endless. Yet where health is concerned, they wet themselves whenever the concept is mentioned.

You must live in cloud cuckoo land. Look at the spend per head on medical care in the US, against the UK. And where a sizable part of the population has no health care at all, other than charity.

BTW, Switzerland spends almost twice as much as the UK on health per capita. Perhaps you think that comes from their magic money tree?

You might also find out what UK NI provides. Or more like partially pays for. You might learn something.

Some things - housing, health, education, transport, and essential food for example - are pretty basic and shouldn't be withheld for lack of money. The fact that you seem to equate health and TV as somehow equivalent is a problem, and suggests it'll take a while for the penny to drop.

Possibly because they resent the fact that people like you feel you have some sort of god-given right to buy up all the best medical care at the expense of everyone else.

Unless you're now going to claim that medical resources in the UK are infinite, and not subject to market forces, same as everything else.

The fact of the matter is Tim, you don't give a s*it about anyone else. The only person you and your kind are ever interested in are yourselves. Like that nonsense you posted about people having a choice. A lot of people don't have a choice, they can barely pay their rent or keep up with their mortgage payments and feed and clothe their kids as it is, never mind paying out for health insurance.

What's fairly obvious is that people like you really don't seem to realise such people exist. Or if you do you simply don't care. You really are that pathetic.

And quite what you're doing posting on a DIY group is another matter entirely. You obviously won't have noticed but Plowman, or "Our Dave" as you condescendingly refer to him with your new best friend Alan, does actually contributes to loads of DIY threads plumbing, painting, electrics cars etc. etc. And regardless of their value at least he actually make a contribution. Whereas I can't actually recall you ever actually contributing anything to a single DIY thread which betrayed any actual knowledge of any DIY skill or activity. They're all more on the lines of "if I get a man in, what should I look for". Just like the old biddies on my local forum. Again, pathetic.

michael adams

...

That's actually you doing the comparison, not I. All I did was make a partial list of things provided by the private sector. And such provision is, AFAIK, uncontroversial. So you have to explain why you would consider private health provision to be a problem. And please, no sentimental claptrap about "profit". All that will do is confirm that you don't know what profit is for.

But they have the second most expensive system in the world, after the USA.

The real problem indoors is aerosols and that does nothing about that.

It isnt, that?s called benefits.

Nope. He used to be 'ok' then something must have happened to him and he became what he is now. ;-(

Yup, a 'left brainer'. Everything they think or say is right and unless you agree with him (or he you), you are just white noise or, the enemy.

This is the consequence of being a left brainer. They become insular and as they do so further and further the worse (the least 'real world') their views / opinions become. ;-(

No, it might just be how he is (so you can't blame him for it as such), and we are all different. My mate also describes left brainers as 'cold and prickly's (compared with right brainers and being 'warm and fuzzy') and they nearly always agree with each other in a way that reveals their lack of empathy and a 'human' / fair approach to anything. Be that health care, the treatment of animals, racism / Little Englanders and of course Brexit.

Yup, and *does* get most of the messages, can read between the lines, can see things from another's POV and is 'kind', all impossible for the left brainers.

Quite, as most of us do, not just the pedantry from the likes of the Squeaker Goblin and he troll friends.

Because he doesn't have any. ;-(

Yup.

I think 'old biddie' actually sums him up pretty well. ;-)

Cheers, T i m