How to drill a hole in a noggin half way down a stud partition wall?

[No Name]

I have now drilled two 32mm holes in the top wall plate from the loft above.

I put a LED light down one hole and I can see through the other hole down to the noggin/dwang in the stud partition wall.

There is no insulation in the cavity and the noggin/dwang is 142 cm down from the loft. (so nothing to catch on the rotating drill bit!)

Now the socket I wish to place is 85 cm below this noggin/dwang itself.

I have already used neodymium magnets to locate the PB screws/nails and I can confirm that they are in the vertical studs and none are present in the noggin/dwang so there is no risk of a drill bit hitting a nail/screw in the noggin.

I have fibreglass rods so fishing cable down through from the loft is trivial.

I can use a stanley knife and a multitool cutter (I have both) to cut the double gang rectangular hole and put the back box into this hole

Now all I need now is a drill bit externder bar that is 1.5m long!

S.

[Mike Clarke]

And adding a blanking plate where it turns the corner to comply with requirements for permitted zones

[No Name]

This looks interesting...... 4 of these coupled up?

S.

[Fredxx]

Safe zones aren't applicable for the OP's networking and coaxial cables.

I have always assumed that a blanking plate can create a "safe zone" but the wiki doesn't imply that and intrigued which regulation might allow it? After all, it might not be obvious it's covering 240V cables.

[www.GymRatZ.co.uk]

Personally I'd chop out a square of plasterboard that spanned both sides of the noggin and cut a rebate into the front side rather than a hole.

Even if you managed to get a 2m drill extension and successfully drilled a hole without the drill wandering off course you'll have a hell of a job poking cable through a hole in a noggin half way down a PB wall.

Cut an access hole, get the cable in and fix a support baton to the top and bottom edges of your access hole, re-fit and attach the PB square, fill the edge gap and paint; you'll probably still end up doing this when you've wasted a day trying to drill a hole anyway. :)

Cheers - Pete

[Robin]

I don't think a box + blanking plate meets the letter of the regulations because they create safe zones "Where the cable is *connected* [emphasis added] to a point, accessory or switchgear on any surface of the wall or partition...".

[Mike Clarke]

Good point. Too far down the thread to remember it was only a co-ax cable but still a good idea to follow the practice. Unlike mains if you drill through an aerial wire or network cable nothing dramatic happens at the time. Depending how much that cable gets used it could be a few days before you find the TV's not working or a computer has no connectivity by which time you don't associate it with having drilled a different bit of wall and have problems finding the cause of the trouble.

It may not be officially recognised but the presence of a blanking plate implies there was something electrical there once and there might still be cables. I would expect anyone aware of the risks of drilling into cables and who was aware of the concept of safe zones would regard a blanking plate as indicating the possible presence of cables. Of course none of this will do anything to protect the person who just blindly drills into a wall directly above a light switch.

[Dave Plowman (News]

Can I ask how often you have done this sort of thing before?

[ARW]

That is quite a good idea. But would you be able to get the drill bit in prefect alignment with the conduit?

[Fredxx]

Steel conduit generally has a 1.5mm wall thickness.

For a 240V installation is that sufficient for mechanical protection?

[Tim+]

Doubt it would need to be perfect. A spade bit fitted into a slot cut into the end of the conduit would probable be ?near enough? to go where you wanted it.

Tim

[Tim+]

But it?s network and coax cables... Even if it was mains, surely more than enough (if you were using standard mains conduit). ;-)

Tim

[John Rumm]

<waves>

Sometimes...

[Fredxx]

Yes, I'm aware these are signal cables.

You would think so, but the current thought is there needs to be 3mm of steel for mechanical protection. Conduit doesn't provide that protection.

[No Name]

I have drilled lots of holes in both studs and joists and wallplates..... as I was upgrading the room's facilities, I used the cut a rectangle of PB out and drill said noggin/dwang with a wood bit and a right angled drill then the whole troom got decorated.

In this case, I already have a fully decorated upstairs room with laminate flooring that is fully multimedia equipped, but I now need an extra 2 co-ax and an extra 2 cat6 ethernet.

[John Rumm]

Or if you drill up through the nogging from the hole you just made for your backbox?

[No Name]

Well I managed it without cutting an access square halfway up the wall top drill a hole through the noggin/dwang!

My steps were:

Locate the vertical rows of PB screws/nails using neodymium magnets. These are clearly the vertical studs

Measure from corner of wall where you want to place the socket bearing in mind where the studs are.

Cut a rectangular hole where new socket is going to go with a multi-tool.

Use a dental mirror and torch to ascertain that theres no pipes, cables in the region of the noggin/dwang.

Go into loft and locate top wall plate for the stud partition wall.

Drill two holes through using a wood bit. Place a white LED and power soource through one hole to illuminate the area above the noggin/dwang.

Use the other hoel to check area is clear of pipes and cables down to noggin/dwang to be drilled

USe a tape measure to mweasure the distance from the hole to the top surface of the dwang/noggin

In my case that was 1.4m.

I then assembled four extender bars and and a SHARP wood bit into one assembly, and inserted this into hole and lowered it to the noggin/Dwang.

Visually inspect through hole to position wood bit to midway between the two sheets of plasterboard and push the drill bit down so the pointy bit goes into the noggin/dwang so it does not move from its position when you start drilling.

Attach a battery powered variable speec drill to the extremely long drill bit assembly.

Drill SLOWLY (as the drill assmbly is NOT straight and will vibrate a bit)

Thanks to the sharp bit, the noggin/dwang was drilled through.

Withdrawn the extra long drill bit assembly.

Now go to socket hole and place a torch shining upwards to the hole drilled in the noggin/dwang

Go back to loft and if you look threough hole, you will see the light shining through the hole in the noggin/dwang.

Now use a length of 2m rigid PVC round conduit and put a cone on the end of it.

Lower said conduit into the hole in wall plate that is directly above the hole in the noggin/dwang.

Then look through the 2nd hole in the top wall plate and you can guide the pointed conical end of the white pipe towards the hole in the noggin/dwang with light shining through.

Then you will find it easily and it will then drop down to the new socket opening.

Go to socket and remove conical plug from conduit and fit a circular terminator and drill the required hole in the back box.

push conduit upwards enough to allow you to put the back socket in and use a finger through the hole to pull the conduit back down guiding the terninator into the socket pack box's hole and screw on the plastic nut.

Voila, you now can drop cables fom attic to wall socket or push through cables into loft from the socket back box!

Job's a good un and no making good fo tiled walls or wallpapering to do!

S.

[Reentrant]

Maybe too late but this just appeared:

[No Name]

Nah, a 1.4 m long wood bit did the job for me from the loft without touching the plasterboard! :-)