Floor varnish changing colour of floorboards

Will a clear polyeurethane varnish like Ronseal Diamond Hard bring down the colour of newly sanded old pine floorboards?

In my last house I used a polyeurethane varnish (I wish I could remember what, but I left the near-empty tin behind when we moved) on sanded pine floorboards dating from 1908 (ie, they were nice and old and seasoned). Obviously, when sanded, the boards had the colour of new wood, but the varnish took this down to a pleasant golden colour.

I'm now in the latter stages of sanding the pine floorboards in the hall of my new house, which were laid in 1963. They've come up well with a belt sander. I want to varnish them with a hardwearing satin or matt varnish, but would like to achieve the same golden colour as on the previous occasion. I don't want to use a coloured varnish, or to stain the wood if I can help it.

Has anyone used one of the modern water-based polyeurethane varnishes, like Ronseal Diamond Hard, and if so, can you tell me if they affect the colour of sanded pine floorboards? If not, what kind of varnish would?

Regards Richard

Reply to
geraldthehamster
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You need the Diamond Hard with the colour tint in it, or you need to stain prior to varnishing. Clear diamond hard will not change the colour significantly, nor will any other clear varnish.

Reply to
RubberBiker

IME most clear varnishes will darken the wood slightly. They may or may not be enough for the effect you seek.

Reply to
John Rumm

Stay away from tinted varnishes, as the floor wears normally the varnish chips, and light marks on dark wood look awful.

Stain might get you what you want, but I prefer to leave them pale initially and let them darken naturally. It doesnt take long to start looking good, and the result is much better imho

NT

Reply to
NT

I've found the water based ones don't produce that lovely mellow glow on pine you got with traditional varnish. But are better for woods you don't want to change the colour of.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

OK, thanks. So what still available now, that you would class as "traditional" varnish?

Cheers Richard

Reply to
geraldthehamster

Thanks. I just wish I could remember what I used last time. I'm pretty sure it was Ronseal, come to think of it. I guess I'll just sad a bit of gash floorboard from the works upstairs, and experiment.

Cheers Richard

Reply to
geraldthehamster

Dunno - look on the tin for brush cleaning instructions. If it needs white spirit it will be oil based.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Any of the high VoC content jobbies, and not the quick drying type. (the latter are not as hard wearing)

Reply to
John Rumm

Varnished pine certainly darkens considerably with oil based varnish. Could be a combination of the varnish and the wood itself changing colour. Doesn't seem anything like as dramatic with a water based varnish - perhaps this blocks out light etc in a different way?

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

What's puzzling is that none of the high VOC varnishes I've seen in the sheds are billed as floor varnishes - for example:

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also have a tin in the cupboard of Ronseal Ultra Tough Satincoat, also high VOC, which I used on a worktop. The tin suggests uses on all sorts of furniture, but omits to mention floors.

I'm puzzled that while the sheds continue to sell high VOC solvent based varnishes, the only ones they have that are explicitly floor varnishes are medium or low VOC water based varnishes. Makes no sense to me.

Regards Richard

Reply to
geraldthehamster

I suppose that makes sense, when you think what happens when you apply oils to wood - not that I suppose the solvents used in varnishes bear much relation to linseed oil, teak oil, etc. ;-) and I suppose in theory the solvent is just a carrier, that evaporates.

Regards Richard

Reply to
geraldthehamster

You could try the old ploy of spraying a mild alkali over the boards, this brings out that nice mellow colour in minutes. Half a teaspoon of caustic soda to a litre of water in a plant sprayer, mist it over, allow to dry. Works a treat.

Reply to
The Medway Handyman

I did that on some new timber shelves once - scrubbed them with caustic. It certainly took the hard edges off, and yellowed the wood. Looked OK once I'd gone over it with Fiddes, but nowhere near as nice as the pine frame of a mirror left on a sunny wall for a year...

Anyway, I have a plan now - I don't see why the Wickes matt high VOC polyeurethane varnish shouldn't be good enough for a floor, so I'm going to try that.

I've spent the past 20 mins reading the archive, and discovered admonitions to use gloss for the under-coats, if using matt for the top, to avoid a milky finish - I'm speculating that this applies to water-based varnish, though.

Suck it and see, I think.

Cheers Richard

Reply to
geraldthehamster

Absolutely. Natural ageing beats staining etc every time. But I reckon the varnish does add to the colour - in the same way as oil based white paint doesn't stay white for long.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

I have both.

Bill

Reply to
Bill Wright

Maybe one reason is that use on a floor can be overwhelming due to the high VOC. On more modest things the absolute amount will be lower.

Reply to
Rod

Which is why the two pack acid cat floor varnishes don't seem to be generally available now. They have the advantage of being extremely tough and totally clear. For a mellow yellow look, I'd use a standard polyurethane, even if it's not specifically for floors. Water based varnishes are certainly clear in the sense that they don't change the colour, but they still have that cling film look, which I think is the nature of the acrylic beast. The harder the resin, the higher ambient temperature it requires to cure and remain clear, so d-i-y stuff is never going to have the toughness you can achieve in a controlled environment

Reply to
Stuart Noble

Right, I'm back, with some test results and another question.

I've done two test pieces on spare board (that was taken up during renovations upstairs), one with Ronseal Diamond Hard Floor Varnish (water-borne polyeurethane, medium VOC), and the other with Wickes Professional Interior Varnish (solvent-borne polyeurethane, high VOC).

As predicted, the Ronseal lowered the colour ever so slightly without really changing it, but left a plasticky-looking finish that I don't like at all. The Wickes produced the lovely golden colour that I was after. However...

The management has decreed that the more natural colour obtained from the Ronseal is to be preferred. In fact, she's right, as it matches the natural wood colour of our stripped and waxed doors (the mellow golden colour worked in the previous house, because the doors themselves were a mellow golden colour, through the application of linseed oil, which is not the case here).

So I'm tempted to use the Ronseal as the first couple of coats, to seal the wood with a lighter colour, then to finish with a couple of coats of solvent-borne matt (or more likely satin), to avoid the plasticky finish. Does anyone know if there could be any problem with applying a solvent-borne varnish over a waterborne one, once the latter has dried? I can't immediately see that problems are likely - I know you have to be careful if doing it the other way round, to make sure the solvent has evaporated, but the water evaporates quite quickly. Could there be issues over the one bonding with the other?

Regards Richard

Reply to
geraldthehamster

Probably won't be any immediate compatibility problems, but a hard varnish on top of a softer one isn't usually a good idea, especially on a floor. You may find that applying the Ronseal differently will change the look. Try brushing it on, then wiping with a rag after a few minutes as if you're trying to remove it. Repeat if necessary (when the first coat is dry), using a circular motion, until the rag starts to "drag". The plastic look is really to do with the thickness of film sitting on the surface, which I prefer to keep to a minimum.

Reply to
Stuart Noble

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