Best way to clean brown stains from toilet bowl ?

We have this problem and there are three complications:

- we are on a septic tank so we have to be careful what bleaches, acids etc we flush down

- we are in a very hard water area (water is from underground aquifers rather than reservoirs in East Yorkshire)

- the most stubborn stains are well below the water line in the U trap so you'd need a huge amount of bleach, acid, etc to achieve a strong enough concentration to have any effect; the stains at or above the water line are trivial to clean off

It is possible to drain off a *bit* of water from the U trap by soaking it up in a cloth and then squeezing the cloth out into a sink. That allows neat bleach etc near where the water line was. But if you take too much out you break the seal in the U trap and a foul sewage smell from the 4" waste pipes and the septic tank quickly permeates the house.

I've tried plastic scourers but there are still areas which refuse to cleaned, despite a lot of elbow grease.

The best way I know to 'empty' the U-bend, for reasons similar to this, is to wear a rubber glove or gauntlet. You then put your arm down, cup your hand, and 'scoop' the water back, over the unseen far side of the U-bend. You can easily get rid of a lot that way.

- To (almost) empty the loo just use a loo brush as a pump.

- To stop any smell from a septic tank start using Muck Munchers

We had a septic tank in a previous bungalow. IIRC the recommendation was to get septic tanks pumped out every couple of years (probably made by the Federation of Septic Tank Emptiers!). We use to have ours pumped every five years or so. But there was always some sediment in the bottom of the tank that was insoluble, such as sand or grit, and the more of that in the tank, the shorter the residence time for the poo to be munched by the bacteria, so I would humbly suggest it's about time you had it pumped (and no, I am not a member of the aforementioned Federation!).

As for the OP's question, a pair of Marigolds, some wire wool and a bit of elbow grease should surely shift what the loo brush can't, and how far round the bend do you need to go anyway, on the basis of 'out of sight, out of mind'?

Yes. I had one of these and I emptied the U bend and filled it full of battery acid many years ago. It fizzed, then stopped, so I brushed the loose sulphate off and it fizzed a bit more. I also attacked it with a cold chisel and broke off many large chunks. This was repeated over server days until it was all clean. That's why I now run a water softener....:-)

I never want to do it again...

Using wire wool on a porcelain surface is a very bad idea. You will never get rid of the scratches.

... snipped We booked a pump-out last year (or perhaps the year before that). The chap looked in the tank, said it didn't need doing, went away, and the office refunded my pre-payment. When I asked how he knew, he said that the clue is the amount of "crust"

- of which we had none. This has reminded me that I've been meaning to do a crust check - now on the list for tomorrow. I'm always wary of falling-in when I open the tank (it's a large

That may well be the case. Faced with a considerable deposit, I worked up to wire wool, then to scrapers and finally polished up with cream cleaner.

There may well be marks that will never be removed, but it looks a great deal more presentable than the previous grotty lump.

Chris

Our tank dated from the 1950's, and was like yours in that it was a two-chamber brick thing, with a wall across the middle over which the contents of the first chamber emptied into the second. The water that drained out of the second chamber was free from solids and was clear, a bit like weak tea.

The crust that formed was regularly about six inches thick by the time we had it pumped. It was also fairly well aerated, a frothy scum. Just the two of us in the property.

Glazed porcelain has a Mohs' hardness of 7-8, while steel has a hardness of 4-5, so I wouldn't expect wire wool to scratch a porcelain toilet.

Just to prove the point, I attacked an out-of-sight area of my toilet bowl both with a Brillo pad and a Spontex steel pot scourer. Both left the area bright and shiny, with not a scratch to be seen.

Very good. :)

After suffering this problem for some 40 years plus the water holes in the rim being extremely difficult to keep clean, I bit the bullet & replaced the pan & cistern for around £100. Luckily I was able to manage this without any assistance - & without the cursing that the original installation caused.

Is it possible that the toilet water (eau de toilette?) has dried up at some or more stages?

You may have soft water, but there may be a small amount of Calcium Sulfate in the water. Possibly, drying out has concentrated this and allowed it to deposit on the porcelain. This is 'permanent hardness', it is physically very hard and will not respond to any realistic chemical treatment. Being hard and not smooth, anything will discolour it. Wire wool won't work, too soft, it'll just give the hardness a grey colour, presumably turning rust-brown after a while.

I've just this morning dealt with this, though it was at the back of the toilet where the flush water runs down, coloured probably by rust somewhere. The only thing which worked (and which I had available) was fine Emery cloth and elbow grease. I don't know if this will abrade the porcelain, I guess it will, but at least the staining has gone.