I know there are auto groups, but I don't hang out in any of them. It's time to change the oil in the car again. I've always run the engine until it's hot before I do it, and then I burn the f*ck out of my hands trying to get the damn filter out of its nest in the exhaust header. (thanks, toyota, for that engineering stroke of genius)
I'm thinking of saying to hell with it, and changing it cold (It's 64 outside now.) How sacrilegious would that be, do you guys think?
OK, that made me chuckle. I feel your pain. Plus on our Avalon the filter's at such an angle that it never drains - but once unscrewed it's almost impossible not to tip it while pulling it from the engine bay, resulting in oil pouring out all over the exhaust.
I think you'll be fine - any crap in the sump (or trapped in the filter) will still be gone, and what little residual oil gets left in the system is insignificant compared to the amount of fresh oil that you're putting in.
cheers
Jules
I really do prefer to change oil hot. I don't have any cars that have the issue you describe, but I can certainly imagine it. I think Mechanix Wear (same people that make the nice gloves) sell sleeve things for just this purpose. Seems silly to put them on just for an oil change, but if it works...
nate
Smitty Two wrote in news:prestwhich- snipped-for-privacy@news.eternal-september.org:
It's not really necessary. the oil is still pretty thin at that temp. (multi-viscosity oils like 5W30 are thin when cold,thicken as they heat up)
I use drive up ramps and wheel chocks.
It's
Dodge Cummins diesel engines have one that you have to have a filter wrench that's on the end of a long rod, and then you have to put it in there just right, going around major steering components.
Why is it that the engineering and design people cannot put these things where they would be simple to reach? Like the old Chevies? I really think Anton Duntov actually thought ahead when he designed the '55 Chevy motor thinking of the guys who would work on them.
Engineers and designers should have to do a scheduled maintenance on EVERY car they design before it is released for production. Hell, you have to go buy special wrenches in some cases.
Steve
Heart surgery pending? Read up and prepare. Learn how to care for a friend.
Just run it a few minutes , or let it cool so its not so hot. I think it will all drain unless its sludge and the oil has been run for
15000.
Fascinated by this thread! I don't change oil any more either. Partly because the current thinking seems to be that newer cars really don't need the orthodox 3000-mile change. I am driving a '99 Nissan Maxima GLE.
I never heard of the "change while hot" idea! What is the "physics" behind that?
Also: Do the commercial "jiffy-lube" (avoid them!!!) type places change hot or cold?
TIA
I think you mean Zora Arkus-Duntov, not Anton. He also did not design the '55 Chevy motor, that was done by another staff of engineers. Zora did however perform tests and improve the performance of the Chevrolet V8 for its use in the Corvette.
I'd think to change the oil when you get back from a trip some whre. Store, pick up the kids, etc. Lift the hood, wait about ten minutes. Use those ten minutes to jack up the vehicle, put the jackstands under. The exhaust is fairly thin metal, and will rapidly cool down. You can also use a spray bottle and put a little water on the exhaust.
I've heard that change the oil hot is the way to go.
The theory is that changing the oil immediately after a drive, the particles of crud are still suspended in the oil. If you change it "cold" the particles have settled out. And then stay in the engine.
Drive through oil change places don't spend the time to let the oil cool. They want the most number of oil changes per working shift. They also want to sell you the air filter, oil filter, differential fluid change, transmission flush, etc.
Gordon Shumway wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
I just saw a PBS show Saturday;"Great Cars",on the Corvette. Duntov was the one who had the V-8 put into the Corvette to improve performance.
The idea is that thick oils will be thinner and drain faster and more complete, also any sludge and/or impurities that can settle out while standing, will be mixed with the oil and drain out as well. It is not necessary to be really hot but to run the engine for a few minutes to warm the oil and mix it up.
Because the engineers and designers are employed by the same company that wants the owners to take them to the dealership for service. They want to make money in the service dept as well.
Rob
Well if you drive your car into a "jiffy lube" JOINT I'd suspect the engine to be hot.
Oil should always be drained hot. AND it should be changed every 3000 miles. Regardless of technology and quailty of oil, engines are still made of cast iron and aluminum, and oil STILL gets dirty in 3000 miles. Period.
Having been a ASE certified master mechanic since '78, it is MY personal opinion that the so called "designers" and "engineers" are all on drugs and have never been close to the finished product. I don't thing any of the "designers" and "engineers" are normal by any stretch of the imagination.
I have two Toyotas, a 4-cylinder Camry and a 6-cylinder Sienna. I also have a 4-cylinder Escort. The two Toyotas have the oil filter mounted above the engine where it makes it easy to remove it without spilling oil all over the place. The Escort's oil filter is mounted underneath/side and has no room to get it out without tipping it sideways which makes oil spill all over the place. At least the Toyota's design allows some of the oil to drain back out. Just make sure you stuff some rags at the base of the filter to catch what little oil does drip out so you won't have to stick your hands deep inside to wipe it off.
I suspect you have the 6-cylinder Toyota and I also cursed the engineer who put the filter underneath the heat shield of the headers. The solution is to just remove the heat shield for good or during the time you are changing the oil. There are only 3 bolts I believe. Mine has been sitting in the garage for years now.
Another good idea is to get the type of oil wrench that is a cap that fits over the top of the oil filter and you can then use a socket extension to undo the filter. Your hands needn't ever get near the headers. If you want to change your oil hot or cold it won't matter anymore, you have plenty of access.
It'd been about 14 years since I last changed my own oil on a vehicle, but I bought this truck as a "toy" mostly for hauling a camper around, and I decided to do it myself.
It's got the 8.1L big block in it, and that baby gets HOT.
Knowing full well that I was going to burn the *living f*ck* out of my hands if I let it run and get hot, I started it up and let it run for only two minutes. Just to stir up the oil and get it circulating.
The oil was nice and cool, and it ran out of the engine fine. It's only 5W30, and it runs like water even cold.
On the other hand, the exhaust manifold was hot already, and I STILL burned the shit out of my hand, and dumped the filter full of oil on the ground trying to juggle it out of the nest of exhaust pipes.
"Steve B" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@news.infowest.com:
And if it was raining you could get in the engine compartment, bring in a droplight and close the hood.
Two reasons... 1) it'll drain faster, and therefore theoretically more completely (assuming the tech removes the drain plug 1st, then removes the filter, then installs the new filter and finally the drain plug, not waiting between steps) 2) a hot liquid can dissolve more (whatevers) and also if the engine has been running recently if there's any loose gunk in there it will be more likely to be still in suspension rather than settled to the bottom of the pan.
So basically, the oil drains faster/more completely, and brings more crap with it when it does drain.
They'll change it however the car is when it is pulled into the bay.
nate
Red Green wrote in news:Xns9E109D493F8EFRedGreen@69.16.185.252:
p.s. ,,,providing you hadn't tossed in a 427 yet.
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