How to convert a JPG picture into a vector drawing for experimentation

[Danny D]

I would like freeware to convert a JPG photo into whatever format I need so that I can "arrange" pumps and pipes around in the drawing to determine an efficient setup (few elbows, no pipes running over pumps, etc.).

Have you ever done that process of arranging blocks in a photo?

Here's how I tried it (but maybe there is a better way)?

I started with this crude photo of the current pump setup:

Here's a quick 1-step conversion to a pencil drawing with The GIMP: {GIMP}Filters->Edge Detect->Difference of Gaussians

Here's a quick conversion of the photo to vector format in Inkscape: {Inkscape}Edit->Select All {Inkscape}Path->Trace Bitmap->(o)Edge detection->Update->OK Inkscape saves a vector diagram, but I can't upload that SVG file; so I'll instead save as a PNG and upload that (but assume all lines are now vectors in the Inkscape SVG or DXF file):

This takes seconds to do; so my question starts from here:

Given this conversion of the photo to either a pencil drawing or to a vector diagram - what freeware would you use to experimentally arrange pumps and plumbing to get an optimal fit?

Constraints:

- As few elbows as possible

- No pipes running over objects

- Easy access to pump baskets & motors

- etc.

[Danny D]

This one is bigger:

[harry]

I don't believe software exists that can do that. Maybe the reverse. This is one job for the human brain.

[Chris Malcolm]

I don't know if any of them are free, but IIRC there are several pipe planner software systems that do this kind of thing, including automating some of the routing for you. It might be easier to start from that end, and then find out which of them will allow the import of some kind of image and work backwards from there.

No, can't give you any details, I just saw some of them being demonstrated many years ago.

[Danny D]

Thanks.

Here's an example of the Hearst Castle from a Google screenshot:

I took a landscaping class at the local recreation department, where we did the planning reviews with large paper blueprints.

In that case, it was all drawn by hand after taking tedious measurements, transferring to block paper, & then to blueprints.

But, the vector blueprint above only took a split second to create from a screenshot of Google maps - saving umpteen hours of drawing were I to draw on graph paper to scale ... so I was just wondering what is out there currently that other people use for blueprints.

No big deal ... just curious (mostly for landscaping purposes).

[Danny D]

Thanks.

I would think there must be software that does this; and I was thinking about the problem at night - so the idea hit me to plan by looking at a photograph.

It's daylight now - so I'll do it by eye again.

Still ... it would be very useful to have the software, simply because it must exist, for planning purposes.

For example, every elbow costs in inefficiency, and every foot of pipe costs the builder a dollar. Certainly if they can eliminate a connection or two, it saves them double that.

In fact, were I to start over, I'd make the whole thing gentle flowing curves of bent pipe, instead of these sharp elbows.

[George]

What you described is done everyday. It isn't free and it does require a lot more than converting a raster image to a vector image which essentially gives you a single shape.

Absolutely. But there is nothing magical that will do it in a few clicks.

[CRNG]

On Sat, 4 May 2013 13:23:09 +0000 (UTC), Danny D wrote in Re Re: How to convert a JPG picture into a vector drawing for experimentation:

Perhaps you can help me. I am looking for some software, free or inexpensive, to enable me to visualize landscape design around my home. However I would like the software to be able to show me what everything will look like after it dies a few months after I plant it. That way I can visualize what I'll end up with.

[harry]

Detailed stuff like that is best left to a skilled/experienced pipe fitter. Some fart in a design office is sure to c*ck the job up. Just schematic drawings are normally given and the detail left to the man executing the work. Who will do a much better job.

The photograph you show looks like a proper pigs ear. Who would want to replicate that?

[Frank S]

My daughter designed university and industrial laboratory plans in AutoCad. Seems to me a dip into the AutoCad universe might yield some useful pathways.

[isw]

Don't forget to factor in the cost of all the planning and design you'll be doing to "eliminate a connection or two". Spending a lot of time/money on that sort of design is only economical when the product will be replicated many times.

Where can you buy plastic pipes in all sorts of "flexible curves", and joints at random angles to match?

Isaac

[Eric Stevens]

Aah but you considerably limited your options when you asked for Freeware. There are commercially available tools at reasonable prices, some of which can do quite a good job. Where time is money, Freeware doesn't seem to cut it.

[Eric Stevens]

Very wise!

[Tegger]

harry wrote in news: [e-mail]:

The OP is asking for quite a lot. He's basically asking for 3D-modeling software that is capable of recognizing exactly what the photograph shows, and drafting it so as to create an editable 3D scene. Wouldn't that be nice if it existed!

Somebody mentioned Google SketchUp. That's about as close as the OP will come to free 3D software. It's actually pretty good but, like all 3D programs, requires that you enter the elements in by hand (or by brain, mouse, and keyboard). However, once in, it's easy enough to push and pull stuff around and get what you need. I've tried SketchUp, but since I already use 3DSMax for work, it's not something I want to invest the time to learn. A designer at one of our suppliers uses SketchUp as her 3D program; she's learned it well enough to make some pretty nice 3D renderings.

[troppo]

Danny D wrote in news:km26jm$1j6$ [e-mail]:

Hi Danny,

I prefer your first image. Looks familiar, probably because I am also a compulsive reconditioner :-)

You mucking around with a pool pump, greywater filter, or does it all fit inside a boat?

First off, I do this sort of thing about twice a week. Real world job, as in, more likely to get paid if I don't stuff up.

Problem with some of your preferred methods are potential lack of real dimensions. This needs CAD, not artwork/presentation tools. CAD works with real dimensions - anything from microns to parsecs.

1. If you have CAD skills but lack high-end software, get the free copy of Dassault Systemes Draftsight. Yeah you have to register to activate it, but you can unsubscribe from the follow-up email news if you find them irritating.

1. Paste your image into Draftsight as an attached image. Use "relative" or none" reference rather than "full".

2. Make sure a key horizontal and/or vertical line is actually horizontal/ vertical. If not, you can rotate the image by small increments. In contrasting colours, trace over all the important lines with lines, arcs or circles with polylines that can be smoothed, and the vertices moved to get an acceptable "fit". Check some known dimensions, eg the width/diameter of a pipe? Looks like there is some 25mm / 1" dia stuff there. Rescale the image and superimposed lines so that the drawn dimension and the real dimension match. Bit of mucking around will be needed to create elevation view from plan view. I assume that like me you aren't skilled in 3D modelling, otherwise you wouldn't be asking the question :-)

Software exists that can convert rasters to vectors, but I think it would make a mess of your project.

Alternative solution? Use flexihose. Maybe use it anyway ...

[Danny D]

Looks like Trimble SketchUp is the suggested raster-to-2D vector program for small one-time home projects such as that which I contemplate.

Googling for a Linux version, I find the closest 1:1 replacement appears to be the open-source Blender

Features:

Download:

I'll test this sequence out: a. Snap a photograph (or screenshot from Google Maps Satellite View) b. Convert to 2D vector diagram (with Inkscape or equivalent) c. Read into 2D/3D CAD software (need to test with Blender)

I'll see what I can do to write up a tutorial for small homeowner projects; and report back when/if successful.

[Dick Alvarez]

Oren wrote Life can be made easier in many ways, by investing in a learning curve. I am thankful that I learned drafting the old way, with drafting boards, T-squares, triangles, protractors, etc., then drafting machines, and finally life became *enormously* easier and neater and more accurate with CAD. Same for many modern instruments and machines. AutoCAD even helps me with photography. Sure, it takes time to learn, and you never stop learning it. But if you do much drafting at all, that learning pays great dividends. I suggest starting with AutoCAD LT. It can do everything that a T-square and triangles and protractor etc. can do, and it is much less expensive and easier to learn. If you use it much at all, it will grow on you. If the pool pump system is the *only* thing that you ever will design, then probably best to stay with the T-square etc. But if you want to go at all beyond that, then go for AutoCAD LT.

[Dick Alvarez]

Oren wrote Life can be made easier in many ways, by investing in a learning curve. I am thankful that I learned drafting the old way, with drafting boards, T-squares, triangles, protractors, etc., then drafting machines, and finally life became *enormously* easier and neater and more accurate with CAD. Same for many modern instruments and machines. AutoCAD even helps me with photography. Sure, it takes time to learn, and you never stop learning it. But if you do much drafting at all, that learning pays great dividends. I suggest starting with AutoCAD LT. It can do everything that a T-square and triangles and protractor etc. can do, and it is much less expensive and easier to learn. If you use it much at all, it will grow on you. If the pool pump system is the *only* thing that you ever will design, then probably best to stay with the T-square etc. But if you want to go at all beyond that, then go for AutoCAD LT.

[harry]

You use flexible pipes rather than rigid ones that need all those fittings.

[Eric Stevens]

For simple @D drafting, Visual Cadd is better than Autocad light, or heavy. See

Visual Cadd will allow you to import JPGs and then draw over the top of them on a different layer.

I speak from many years experience of pencil, ink, paper, film, and CAD systems. But it's not free.

But have a look at Visual Cadd: it's faster and in the long run cheaper.