Humanure!?!

Used extensively in Asia "night soil". Precuation is that all produce has to be extensively cooked or risk dysentery and other fun stuff.

Yes, I have heard of the use of "night soil" not only in Asia but, also, before the widespread use of chemical fertilizers in the US and Europe. Do you have any sources, that you can recall, that refer to it?

Thank you, Gello

Just a few minutes ago, I flushed some into the septic tank :-)

Seriously, though, the stuff will work. The problem is that human du-du often has human pathogens. Using the waste from a bunch of people for food crops is a really good way to 'spread the wealth' -- when one person gets sick, everyone else is at risk.

Remember, the grass is always greener over the septic tank :-)

Ray

Feces contain plenty of pathogens even in healthy people so applying it to your soil is a definite health risk - not to mention that it will annoy the neighbours and they can call down the law on you. Urine OTOH is a rich source of nitrogen, much less offensive and it is sterile in healthy people.

David

Even if it is composted and aged for several years?

My closest neighbor is a mile away. Don't think they will mind if I walk out in my "lawn" and deficate in the middle of it.

Please look at the book "The Humanure Handbook" for a good explimation of what I am asking about. My original post didn't explain it, sorry. Thank you.

Gello

I forgot to include the link. Here it is.

On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 12:15:59 GMT in , "Gello" graced the world with this thought:

a couple years? Why are you bothering?

No offense, but I'm curious what spawned the need to use human feces for fertilizer when there are so many better options available other than human, that you plan on waiting to use?

g'day gello,

we have a composting toilet so when the end product has been composted in the cycle of using the bin we add it to our gardens under a layer of medium the plant roots only access it, not looking to any problems as it has been sitting for over 7 months composting with the help of worms. big diffeence between using raw sewage and composted poo, looks just like any humus material you might create from most other recyclable material no smell and no resemblence to its original form.

len

snipped

Excellent! Finally, someone with actual experience and knowledge!

Thanks for responding. What encouraged you to use such a overlooked resource and what resources did you use to make the decision?

Thanks, Gello

Some years ago I read that Wessex Water here in the UK were selling pelleted dried sewage fertiliser, in addition to the spreading it on the fields/injecting it into the soil that they do for farmers. Don't know if they still do it or not. I have a feeling Norsk hydro may also have been involved.

Steve

I suppose it would be more prudent to use it on, say, tomatoes than, say, carrots. I know dozens of people who compost, but no one waits several years to use the compost. If one were to start using the stuff, who is to say that after a while corners will not be cut. I am the first to admit that total cleanliness is impossible, mice and birds will visit the garden or compost pile and leave droppings there. One gives himself a lot of breathing room by using semifresh manure (all kinds) in places where there is no contact between crop and soil. As luck may have it, most underground crops, except potatoes which need cooking anyway, do prefer soil that was manured the year before. Garlic, beet, carrots, parsnips, radish, all prefer mellower soil and/or relatively low need for nutrients.

Just so long as you don't do it the day before your buddies come for a little football pickup game on the lawn.

I was wondering about that. Thre are a lot of composting toilets out in the boonies and I couldn't think that folks were wasting the composted output. Thanks.

Do any of your neighbors have the same setup?

...snip...

It's the composting step that is hazardous and smelly, unless you do it in a closed container, in which case you have just invented a form of sewerage works.

There are many such alternatives on the domestic scale these days. Have you looked at composting toilets? Here (Australia) such things are available commercially, as are the plans, and they may be acceptable to your local authorities. We are on 50 acres and the neigbours are a long way off so we looked into these but decided that this method wasn't for us because:

- you have to add plant material, eg sawdust after each deposit as the doins are not balanced enough to get the right bacteria going alone

- there is inevitably some smell

- you have to empty it out manually to use the results on the garden and even if the bulk of material is well composted you will need a strong stomach for this.

We settled on an aerated waste treatment system that puts most of the nutrients into the soil after it is rendered harmless.

David

g'day gello,

not something i can answer in one line, but i sort of generated to that way of thinking, or it could ahve been evolved. my health failed badly on me i lost my career and the indipendence that gives, so started looking ro reason and ended up at permaculture. this led me to look at how we treat mother earth and her finite resources so when the opportunity came i took the step.

if i had stayed in the 'burbs i would have still installed a drop toilet (illigaly of course) just would be boasting about it to all and sundry.

the way i see it sewerage still pollutes our waterways, and septic pollutes the aquafa, and all should wonder at the wisdom that society has developed that leads us to dump our cast off to a local authority you know slam the lid, don't look at it lest it infest us, and push a button to use valuable drinking water to flush it on its way. can't imagine at the further wisdom of people moving to rural and using even less available water resources to flush to a septic tanks and then to a leach field!!??

then all i needed to do was research the different makes of toilets and opted for the one that is the simplest in design, no moving parts well apart from the lid hinge that is.

that's about it in a nut shell gello, but will gladly answer any questions you may have feel free to e/mail me if you wish.

len

snipped

g'day larry,

usually if someone installs a composting toilet they already have a use for the end product, in my case i couldn't wait to get me hands onto it, the end product that is, and get it working in the soil.

none of my near neighbours have one, you need to remember that society has moulded our thinking from the more organic simple ways of the past to a more so called sofisticated way, you may say. so when they move to rural where water is a more valuable resource because you have to create your own water supply no reticulated systems out here, and then supply power to a pump to flush a loo that resembles the sewerage loos' of the cities, silly realy isn't it? and then to top it off they then go and buy soil improvers to add the their gardens mmm wonder sometimes.

there are many people using systems but not near me.

you need to remember how we live has been influenced by other sources, and to make sure we adhere they feed in hype and the fear of the unknown, which then gives those who don't want to look at or deal with the issue something to hide behind.

len

snipped

I seem to remember that Milorganite was a product of the City of Milwaukee's waste treatment system. Either that product or a similar one was found to be high in heavy metals, which found its way into the plants. Why heavy metals............. could be that some of the metal plating companies dump their wastewater into the sewer system?

Robert

Farmers of Forty Centuries by F. H. King

Thanks for the reference. I have that book somewhere......

Gello