We wonder why americans are so fat.

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http://matt-massie.com/archives/images/24fitness.jpg
I really cracked up with this picture.
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Knight-Toolworks & Custom Planes
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Hey that is the new multi person "Stair Climber". It runs in reverse. LOL

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Steve Knight wrote:

I've seen people waiting for the front row parking spots at my gym.
I've also fought with two gyms over a lack of bicycle parking. The first gym suggested that no one was interested in riding a bicycle to the gym, as the gym had stationary bikes. <G>
My current place accommodated me, there are now 4 others who cycle to the gym! We get our cardio on the way to the gym, rather than in it.
Barry
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On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 12:26:45 +0000, B a r r y wrote:

After a couple of months of going to the gym, I realized the absurdity of driving there and then spending 20 minutes on an exercise bicycle or treadmill, especially since the 5km ride is mostly uphill both ways. But I did wimp out this winter despite having studded tires on my bike. Don't trust the drivers.
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Luigi
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Escher is the urban planner in your area?
Mike
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On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 19:52:33 +0000, Michael Daly wrote:

Ackshally, time wise it is. To get there takes me about 12 minutes, of which about 7 are spent climbing a hill, three minutes on the flat and 2 minutes downhill. 35 minutes return, mostly climbing (2 big steep hills).
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Luigi
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wrote:

Well, since the roads were built for automobile traffic ....
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ The absence of accidents does not mean the presence of safety Army General Richard Cody +--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
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I
Actually, most states have laws on the books that state that bicycles are "intended users" of the road system.
todd
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wrote:

Yes, I know those laws are on the books. Doesn't change the fact that bicycles travel 10 to 20 mph below normal traffic speed, are at an extreme disadvantage, particularly on blind curves and are always going to be on the losing side of any encounter with a car.
Sorry, just hit a sore spot with me, I live in an area near subdivisions where people think that a narrow, 2 lane road with very narrow shoulders is a great place to go riding. This road also has blind curves where one coming around a corner could potentially hit a bicyclist travelling 25 MPH on a 40 MPH road in many cases, the bicyclists don't use the shoulder since the shoulder is barely there. The answer is *not* to penalize the people using the road for its *really* intended purpose by making the speed limit slower, it is hoping that somehow these recreational riders would gain a bit of wisdom and courtesy and realize that a) they are endangering themselves, and b) through their actions they are inconveniencing others, taking away time from those people who might also like to get home or get their business done so that they also can enjoy some recreational activities.

+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ The absence of accidents does not mean the presence of safety Army General Richard Cody +--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
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: Sorry, just hit a sore spot with me, I live in an area near subdivisions : where people think that a narrow, 2 lane road with very narrow shoulders is : a great place to go riding. This road also has blind curves where one : coming around a corner could potentially hit a bicyclist travelling 25 MPH : on a 40 MPH road in many cases, the bicyclists don't use the shoulder since : the shoulder is barely there. The answer is *not* to penalize the people : using the road for its *really* intended purpose by making the speed limit : slower, it is hoping that somehow these recreational riders would gain a : bit of wisdom and courtesy and realize that a) they are endangering : themselves, and b) through their actions they are inconveniencing others, : taking away time from those people who might also like to get home or get : their business done so that they also can enjoy some recreational : activities.
What vehicle do you drive?
    -Andy Barss
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On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 06:52:00 +0000 (UTC), Andrew Barss

Unless it's a motorcycle, what difference does that make?
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ The absence of accidents does not mean the presence of safety Army General Richard Cody +--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
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I have always told my son that the pedestrian always has the right of way but to never try to test that fact.
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Mark & Juanita wrote:

What's the speed limit on that curve? Not what's normally driven, the legal limit?
Barry
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Where I live in Georgia I have to deal with tractors going down the road. They sometimes go slower than the cyclists. I deal with cow crap from cow hauling trailers. There used to be farming where you lived 20-30 years ago pre yuppy scum days.
Is it possible that your driving of your car is taking away from the rights of those who might want to enjoy their recreational acticvities but are intimidated by you driving 50 in a 40 zone? Are the rights of an automobile driver or drivers greater than that of the other taxpayers who may not be in a car? Not all roads are built with automobile fuel tax dollars. Riding where you live stinks. About the only safe time to ride is Sunday mornings but that is quite dangerous with the Baptists hellbent on getting to church to talk about love as they run folks off the road. If you can dodge the Baptists or Presbyterians or Methodists or Lutherans you can have an ok Sunday morning ride. The Seventh Day Adventists are not much of an issue.
Bicyclists are not required to ride on the shoulder. State law. Most Georgia roads don't have shoulders as an option. Have you lobbied your state and local representatives for shoulders on the road without wakeup cuts so that you can fly home without runners and cyclists in your way? Don't forget to lobby for sidewalks which allow kids a safe way to get around as well as old folks out for strolls trying to recover from years of driving cars.
Waiting a minute or a few minutes to get around a tractor or cyclists or old folks driving slow only kills someone if they pass stupidly. you got 1440 minutes in the day. 2 minutes does not have to ruin your day.
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Ahhhh... beware of the Religious Right-of-Way!
You cracked me up, Jim..thanks for that.
0?0
Rob
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On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 14:22:24 GMT, Jim Behning

... snip

I live in the desert, wasn't much farming where I live, it was all desert ranchland or wasteland. Try again.

What about my driving 45 in a 45 zone? While they are doing, to be generous, 20.

Why were the roads built? What was the intended purpose? Not what some activists got passed into law later, but the real, intended reason for building paved two lane roads?
Or, by your logic, I should be perfectly justified riding a 4 wheeler down that same road. After all, I'm a taxpayer who is using that road I helped build. Guess what, anybody doing that gets ticketed -- they have to ride those vehicles in approved areas.

That's funny, seems there are equal numbers of bicyclists out both Saturdays and Sundays.

Wouldn't do any good, the more developed areas nearby have bike lanes, bicyclists don't use any part of them other than the 3 inches closest to the automobile lane.

.. a tractor or a car with old folks are people out there using the road as intended -- the one is using it for livelihood, the other to get from place to place, and time has caught up with them vis a vis reaction times or just the way they always used to live. It may be an inconvenience, but it's unavoidable, they aren't out there deliberately inconveniencing others.

... and that illustrates my point regarding courtesy perfectly. That 2 minutes is *not* *your* two minutes to take away from me or any other person. Your two minutes, plus the half dozen to a dozen other yuppies out there in their oh-so-manly lycra-spandex bike suits each taking their two minutes starts adding up to a pretty decent chunk of time. Doesn't matter much though whether it's 30 seconds or two minutes, if you are needlessly inconveniencing someone else, it's still discourteous. As I mentioned above, other recreational riders have to pursue their fun in suitable places, why is this situation different, just because a few activists were able to convince some legislators?
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ The absence of accidents does not mean the presence of safety Army General Richard Cody +--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
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but it is ok for other cars to inconvenience you as in traffic? cars and other motored vehicles cause far more delays then any amount of cyclists well ever do. plus more deaths more pollution more problems and more dependence on foreign oil.
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Mark & Juanita wrote:

Are you kidding? <G> "Deliberately inconveniencing others"?
Few cyclists LIKE riding roads like you describe, but they HAVE TO in order to get to the more desirable roads. Many road cyclists go 50,60, 75, or more, miles on a good weekend ride. We would LOVE to stay out of your way, but often have zero choice when connecting one area to another.
Should they load up the car and drive from 5 mile loop to 5 mile loop? Ride in circles on a running track?

Those suits are incredibly comfortable and functional. If you got out much, you'd see cross country skiers, ice skaters, climbers, and long distance runners in similar clothing. Even major league baseball, football, and basketball players are discovering how well this stuff works. As a 40 year old, 6'1", 230 pound man who also plays hockey, downhill mountain bikes, uses power tools, lifts weights, etc... I've never felt less than manly wearing jeans, hockey pants, or spandex bike shorts.
I guess my manlyness certainly doesn't come from my clothes, as I even feel manly naked! Besides, some of the women I ride with look incredible in those shorts. <G>
FWIW, I frequently use my bikes as genuine transportation. I'm actually going somewhere else, including my office. I'm often dressed in spandex on these rides, too, for performance and comfort reasons. Maybe I should start wearing a sign stating my recreational vs. transportation intent?
Barry
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my bike is my transportation. I even haul all of my lumber on a trailer. and I am lucky in that I don't have to travel busy roads (G) but hey thick of all the tool money you would Dave if you did not drive.
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On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 20:33:17 -0800, Steve Knight

Steve,
    I recognize that for some people a bicycle is their sole transportation. That's a somewhat different situation. However, I would hope that people in that situation also recognize that there are routes that really are not a safe place to ride for that transportation.
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ The absence of accidents does not mean the presence of safety Army General Richard Cody +--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
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