Re: view rec.woodworking in a new way

Page 1 of 2  


care.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
For a copy of my TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter, send email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
snipped-for-privacy@wi.rr.com says...

... and I'm not an academic, thus I have no time. :-)

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Ayup. About how I feel about online surveys purported to "help with research".
If I'm in a really good mood, I fill them in and lie on every question.
djb
--
It's probably time to change my sig line, eh?

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

That would be a sad day indeed.
"Anonymity is a shield from the tyranny of the majority... it thus exemplifies the purpose behind the Bill of Rights, and of the First Amendment in particular: to protect unpopular individuals from retaliation -- and their ideas from suppression -- at the hand of an intolerant society." - SC Justice John Paul Stevens
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

The problem is not that MIT runs an anonymizer service; rather, the problem is that MIT refuses to do anything about the abuse of that service. And of course, no one is asking that the government take action against MIT's anonymizer. Instead, we are exercising our rights of free association, in deciding not to associate with those who are associated, however loosely, with those who permit the untrammelled abuse of what could be a useful service.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
For a copy of my TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter, send email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
snipped-for-privacy@milmac.com (Doug Miller) wrote in

Thank you Doug, that was very well said.
John
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Gak. Given your love of authoritarianism, I can see where you find anonymity threatening, but don't speak for me.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
p_j wrote:

Why not, you seem to be speaking for everybody else. I'd bet that Doug's view is the predominant view here. Let's try some democracy. I vote that MIT's anonymizer be removed and until that happens MIT not be welcome. I wrote Ethan and had my e-mail addy removed from his survey, but I didn't get any response to my feelings about his use of my comments without his asking/informing me of his intent to use the material.
Anonymity may be a shield against authority, but when it is used to shield a person from taking responsibilility for their actions it is mere cowardice.
Dave in Fairfax
--
reply-to doesn't work
use:
daveldr at att dot net
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
"dave in fairfax" wrote in message

Well said ... the "tyranny of the majority" is another phrase for "democracy".
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 3/27/04
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

When? Where?

Whoopie. He also thinks that WMD have been found in Iraq and that Clinton killed Vince Foster.

That's a poll, not democracy.

Huh? Are you calling Doug a coward for hiding his name and address?
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
give it a break will ya....
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

Ummm, no, actually I didn't say that. I *have* said that failure to find them does not equal proof that they were never there.

Jeeez. That was tongue-in-cheek, but I guess it was a bit too subtle for you.

I'm not hiding my name -- that's my real name. My email address is in the signature line of all my posts. *You* OTOH *are* hiding *your* name.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
For a copy of my TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter, send email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Doug Miller writes:

Hey, what the hell. Some months ago, a woman told me I was exceptionally selfish, as shown by my "handle," Charlie Self.
Charlie Self "It is not strange... to mistake change for progress." Millard Fillmore
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

Did you actually read what I wrote before your knee jerked so hard?
Don't put words in my mouth. I never said, or even implied, that I found anonymity "threatening" or even objectionable. Nor did I indicate a "love of authoritarianism", in that post or anywhere else.
The sole problem is that MIT refuses to take any sort of action against those who use their anonymizer service to, among other things, flood newsgroups with vile and abusive posts.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)
For a copy of my TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter, send email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

As a newbe here, I do not understand what a remailer or anonymiser are. I am not supporting the original poster at all. It seems that the MIT remailer and/or anonymiser have sent many unwanted postings and caused much grief within this group. I just want some information. Bring me up to speed on this please.
Hoyt W.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Hoyt Weathers wrote:

If you do a Google search at: http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&group=rec.woodworking on dizum.com, remailer.metacolo.com, nym.alias.net or sneakemail.com You will find abusive and libellous threads that were sent through remailers or anonymizers. This is a message pass-through server that loses the origin of the message deliberately and replaces it with its own header info. The result is that it is nearly impossibel to trace the message to tis origin. Many of these servers are out of country or at edu facilities where they can hide behind a difference in laws or behind the pretence of freedom of speech. If you read the threads and look at the header info all will become clear. Dave in Fairfax
--
reply-to doesn't work
use:
daveldr at att dot net
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
dave in fairfax wrote:

Thank you Dave for your detailed explanation. Your reply is much appreciated as was the direct e-mail reply I received from another Wrecker. Each of the replies have helped me. Thank you both.
Hoyt W.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

To give some history, the first anonymizer was set up at penet.fi, many years ago. It was set up to allow people in oppressed countries a means to comment on their gov't, etc, without fear of retaliation; it was also used by abused spouses, folk looking for abortion info, and similar situations. It worked well for several years in the early days of Usenet, but it was eventually found by vandals who abused it's anonymity, and the operator eventually shut it down because they couldn't control the abuse.
Since then, many other anonymizers have been started. All of them have been targetted by vandals to a greater or lesser extent, most of them have made some efforts to control the abuse (either by preventing the IP addresses known to be sources of abuse to access the anonymizer, or by restricting the output of the anonymizer to groups where anonymity might reasonably be appropriate, or both). It is a difficult task, because even in situations where a person posted anonymously for a valid reason people will complain it's abusive because of it's anonymity; the remailer admin has to judge if the complaints really reflect abusive use or if the complainer is trying to prevent someone's legitimate free speech.
Nym.alias.net is noteworthy for making no attempt whatsoever to control abuse. While this undoubtably makes life much simpler for their admins, it's rather an unpleasant burden for the rest of Usenet's users.
John
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
John McCoy wrote:

Thank you John for adding additional information. I now understand why the OP was jumped on so quickly and forcefully by so many Wreckers.
On another topic, I have used both Top Saver and Rust Off + Johnson Wax to treat my DP table. I let the wax harden overnight. I will now go out to the shop and polish off the wax.
Regards, Hoyt
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

http://www.mids.org/pay/mn/701/anon.html
That's somewhat 'revisionist history', to say the least. I happened to be casually acquainted, _AT_THE_TIME_OF_THE_EVENTS_, with Julf Helsingius, the guy that developed/ran it.
It wasn't the 'first', nor was it the only one available at the time. What it _was_ was 'durable'. (Most other anonymous remailers had had _very_ short life-spans -- typically a few weeks at best -- as they came to the attention of 'higher management', due to the traffic levels they generated.)
Large-scale abuse of the anon.penet.fi remailer was _rarely_ a problem. Julf was *extremely* good at policing it, aided in large part by the fact that getting an 'account' _anywhere_ with Internet access was non-trivial. "Free email address" providers simply _didn't_exist_ in those days. etc. Hell, "commercial Internet Access Providers" were virtually non-existent.
"anon.penet.fi" was closed down because the Church of Scientology *sued* it, with a subpoena demanding the identity of a person posting The CoS's "confidential material" through it. The CoS _literally_ showed up on his doorstep with (a) the cops in tow, and (b) search-warrant in hand. Julf had an 'unpleasant' choice -- give up the identity of that one account, or have his _entire_ system confiscated and searched.
Julf determined that the _legal_climate_, where he was, was such that he couldn't guarantee the anonymity he'd been promising. This was a "rude surprise", not just to him, but to a large part of the Finnish Internet community. The courts had decided to interpret laws in a way that -nobody- there thought plausible/likely.
By the time he shut down, there were several other 'reliable' (at least in the sense of an extended life-expectancy :) anonymous remailers existent.
Julf simply didn't have the resources, legal and otherwise, to 'fight the battle'.
There's a _quality_ review of the history available at: <http://www.mids.org/pay/mn/701/anon.html

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Site Timeline

Related Threads

    HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.