Heating A Shop

[Mark]

There are times one has to offer their credentials to validate their assertions.

I have a degree in Aviation Maintenance and hold a A&P (Airframe and PowerPlant).

Aviation Maintenance is among the most hazardous professions, mostly due to the substances we work with. In this profession (as well as many others) one learns there are long term consequences to chemical exposure. The effects of exposure to many substances is accumulative.

Because there are no apparent ill effects from exposure today does not mean there will be no ill effects tomorrow, next week, month, year or decade.

A breathable atmosphere is no guarantee of safety. I feel a breathable atmosphere is one of the greatest dangers. I lulls the breather into thinking there is no or little danger. Urethane based coatings with a catalyst are an excellent example. Everyone knows to get the hell away and upwind while Emron (i.e.) is being applied, they don't seem to know or care Emron (i.e.) gasses for up to several days. These gasses are breathable but in no way are they healthy.

I don't care to know what vapors turn into when raised to a high temperature or ran through a flame. I will not be exposed to them, or keep my exposure to a minimum if I have to be exposed.

I will note: I no longer work in The Industry. I had become sensitized to widely used substances. It's getting tempting to answer the fliers I get from contracting companies. I love the work but I don't want to get poisoned again.

Explosion hazard? A flash over is more excitement than I care to experience. It wouldn't have to raise the roof, blow out the windows or drop the building. Even if the odds are one in a million Why take a chance? My flesh isn't healthy enough as it is, but I think I want to keep it intact. Burnt or blown off is not an appetizing thought, least for me.

I've become extremely protective of my health. I'm 45. About ten years ago those things I did in my youth started catching up with me. Motorcycle mishaps. Exposure to chemicals. A couple slipped disks from an "encounter" with SWMBO in the shower. :]

If this is what it feels like to be 45 (especially my neck), I'm not into adding to what I've already done. It's going to happen, I'm going to get damaged again, I just know it. I'm not chasing it like I use to.

[Greg O]

I am with you on this Bruce. I work as a HVAC tech and I see commercial shops with natural gas heat with exposed burners. Strangly, none of them have blown up even though the dust accumulation inside the furnace is unbelieveable! I worked on one the other day that had a good inch of saw dust, right in the burner area. I would like to see an article of a dust explosion in a home, or even a small commercial shop. Greg

[Morgans]

Amen, brother.

Well put.

[Morgans]

I have PERSONALLY seen contact adhesive fumes catch, ignited by a space heater, flash back to the drying laminate. Little bits of soot floated through the house, requiring a re-painting of nearly every surface.

Good enough? It cost enough.

[Greg O]

How close was the heater? I have no doubt that it can happen if the heater is near enough to the the work surface. Careless accidents can happen. Portable space heaters are probably very high on the list for causing fires.I want to know about properly installed furances, shop heaters causing explosions or fires from dust or fumes. I don't think you will find many instances. Greg

[Charlie Self]

Morgans notes:

Yeah, well...it isn't really necessary to buy contact adhesive that has such a volatile solvent base. Titebond Neoprene Plus Contact Adhesive is one example.

Charlie Self "Ain't no man can avoid being born average, but there ain't no man got to be common." Satchel Paige

[Edwin Pawlowski]

Contact cement has been documented over the years. I did not seen it, but I've seen the results of a flash. -- My sister's house during a kitchen remodel.

Dust is another story. I've never heard of any. You have a whole different scenario of physics taking place. A volatile gas is much different that a solid suspended in air. Particles can actually pass through and burn in a flame and not set off the chain reaction that a gas will. Ed

[Lew Hodgett]

ABSOLUTELY.

Using any solvent based contact adhesive, be it used for laminate or floor covering such as tile or carpet, it is mandatory that every burner and pilot light be turned off before you start working.

Learned that lesson from a guy who refaced kitchen cabinets.

First thing he would do is shut off the natural gas or propane in the house.

Many years ago, by chance was having dinner with a guy in the carpet installation business. (We were both sailors and he invited me to dinner)

He told me of one of his experienced installers who missed a pilot light on a heater.

About 30-45 minutes into the job, the fumes ignited sending a ball of flame along the floor.

Good thing the poor bastard died quickly, guess there wasn't much left to scrape up and bury.

If you suspect you are going to be working with adhesives that contain VOC's, make sure there are no open flames in the building.

If you don't give a damn about yourself, so be it, especially if your life insurance is paid up; however, have a little consideration for others who may be in the area. Maybe their insurance isn't paid up.

[Silvan]

Likewise here in southwestern Virginia. My benchtop has all kinds of sweat stains, and I was tempted more than once to take my wall air conditioner back from Mom.

[Morgans]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From your own above words. ===I don't think you will find many instances.====

My god, man, how many would it take, for you? One is too many for me!

I can see nothing will come close to changing your mind.

Good day.

[Morgans]

Read fire codes. Your insurance may not pay if you have a problem and are not in compliance.

[Mark]

Good enough for me.

There are going to be those wanting more proof, like a video.

[todd]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I bet more than one person died in their car today. I guess that means you don't drive. It's all a matter of risk. My understanding is that as far as dust goes, no one has documented a dust explosion in a home shop. As for flammable vapors, care would have to be exercised, like in many aspects of woodworking.

todd

[Edwin Pawlowski]

I'm not sure what this means. The regulations of the University of Texas are not necessarily going to be enforced by my insurance company in CT.

Their regulations make a lot of sense overall, but they do not change the laws of physics. This question comes up frequently here, but no one has ever provided proof of a home shop fire caused by static electricity in a dust collection system or an open flame heater. Ed

[Morgans]

=====================

You think they just invented this stuff? It was what I came across first.

I'm done with this. You all do what you want. I, myself, will do what I can to eliminate risks that are unnecessary.

[Silvan]

Yup. Me three. First year out here, we filled it three times. Then we got used to the heat pump, and now we're filling it once and paying the $67 fee every year.

I should get rid of it and get a smaller tank, but it's there, and I'm lazy. It's nice knowing I have all that gas if we have an *c* st*rm too.

The bad part is I can't use any of it to heat my shop. Too far away.

[Silvan]

I can get natural gas too, for only $13,500. Whee!

[Greg O]

Well, in my case I rarely spread flamable solvents or adhesives around my shop, certainly not in the imediate area of a portable heater! I doubt my forced air furnace that is hanging 8 feet in the air will ignite contact cement on a bench top 8-10 feet away. Your burning contact cement episode sounds more like pure carelessness, but then you blame it on a heater! Again I ask, "How far from your work area was the heater?" Pretty close is my guess! Greg

[Greg O]

I do not argue whether it happened or not, I would just like to know the conditions under which it happened! My bet is the heater was very close to the adhesive, a foot or two at the most. Unless it was a Knipco style heater, then a few feet in front of the heater would suffice. Greg

[Morgans]